[joker]

I respectfully disagree. I think it's all in how the details are framed. This can't be framed to be about keeping private places private, tempting though that may be, and as much as that may be the concern many have about social media. I think that must be explicit in any goals used to guide a drafting of suggested guidance.

[markweth]

[markweth]

[RumiDude]

[Bernardo]

I see lots of problems with telling folks not to post pictures, trip reports, etc. Sounds a lot like protecting privilege. Maybe the world would be a better place if the wilderness were less pristine and the masses spent more time in the wilderness. Not advocating for degradation, but more access is probably better than less.

[Kim Brown]

They're not proposing to not post reports and photos, just saying to think twice. For instance , some thinking twice may post a report, but be judicious about details, posting gps route and which or how many photos to use. Let folks know about the place but they should do thier own research and looking at maps and knowing something about mileage, gain, and how to determine, within reason, terrain, possible camp sites etc. In other words, consider not spoon-feeding. It's not a command, it's a suggestion. I think a lot of people are already being selective about what they post.

[AlpineRose]

I think not spoon feeding is a great idea. imo, anyone following a GPS track obtained from someone else is being spoon fed. Gobble, gobble. Following that same line of thought, anyone following their own GPS track back to their campsite or the trailhead is spoon feeding themselves. The metaphor would be an animal who regurgitates its food as part of its feeding process for itself or its young.

[Randito]

[Kim Brown]

[mb]

It's the irony of this generation of information technology: It allows for infinite and instant distribution. Yet that means things get focused instead: everyone can, and must, share that Perfect Shot of the #coollocation near them. Be that the local bakery which just got a review, local park, or previously-obscure-but-achievable mountain top. And at the same time we've built filter bubbles... maybe in the Old Days there could be some shows on the Nightly News about LNT principals and a significant %age of the population would see it. But now it's just sound bites. So the best solution might be modern prooganda: make a mini Viral Video about... something LNT related. And I agree the maps are so key. Lots of sekret locatoins are just there on the map and you can ask your phone, "HAL, take me to the #coolinstagramspot" and it'll give you exact directions such that you don't even have to spend the energy to raise your eyes from staring at your phone while walking. (It always amazes me some of the places on maps. Idiots who don't realize that putting all the sekret spots is a bad idea--they're often kept secret because of some capacity limited. You don't want a Bureacratic Solution for most of them, because that's most simply done with Closure.) And yes, I use GPS tracks and idiot-created maps to go to cool spots. It's so much easier!

[Randito]

[RumiDude]

It is a futile endeavor trying to control the actions of people in the future. Rumi

[cartman]

This so-called "8th Leave No Trace" principle is simply a politely worded attempt to tell others to STFU. Posting trip reports on social media has several purposes for me, including sharing the experience and using FB and nwhikers as informal blogs to look back at the memories. "We are not secret keepers." If the owners of that blog want to be taken seriously, making a disingenuous statement like that isn't a good way to start. Of course you are, and you want the rest of us to be like you. First off, in the current and future social media atmosphere, this will never happen so you're wasting your time. Secondly, the places that are being "loved to death" are a very small minority of the places that are available to go to, and are usually the places that are most easily accessed, and yes, have been most popularized in writing including on social media sites. However, the vast majority of the alpine requires more effort to reach it. Even a relatively easy to reach place like Jade Lake is an overnight backpack for most people, which means it's not likely to be overrun because that requires planning and effort most casual hikers aren't going to bother with to get that selfie. Even more absurd is the griping, including on this site, about posting details to a place like Berdeen Lake or the Berdeen High Route/Bacon to Blum Traverse. No, a place that requires that sort of effort to reach isn't going to be overrun. Are more people going to go there if details are posted on how to reach it? Most likely, but not that many; and that is not a bad thing. One would hope and expect that anyone competent enough to get there is already educated and experienced enough to respect the area, and the vast majority likely will be. Third, suggesting this as an additional LNT principle does major harm to the other principles, which are based on responsible stewardship of the environment. Adding this is unrealistic and dilutes the message of LNT, to the likelihood of ignoring it altogether for some--which is counterproductive to the intent of the new principle. Finally, telling others what they should or should not post is a vast overreach, and ultimately treads on freedom of speech, which is anathema to most Americans. Discouraging people to go anywhere, including your supposed "hot spots", IS elitist. It is a way of saying "you can go anywhere you like as long as you don't go where I like". Remember the NCCC and Wilderness Watch lawsuits attempting to halt repair of the Suiattle River Road? Their cynical and selfish attempt to limit access? This new "principle" is reminiscent of that, just worded more politely, but targeted far more broadly--everywhere, as opposed to just one road. But the ultimate intent is the same. If you don't want to share the details on how to get to a place, more power to you. But don't tell others what they can or cannot post. A far better and more effective tactic would have been to come up with a new way to reach the younger generation about responsible stewardship of wild places--using social media!

[Tom]

In a binary world that might be the only conclusion. I see it more as a suggestion to think in non-binary terms. I don't necessarily see it as elitist or selfish to be discreet if the motivation is to allow the next visitor to experience a place in as close to the same state that you did.

[cartman]