Forum Index > Public Lands Stewardship > Federal Prosecution for hitting a bird with your car?
Previous :: Next Topic  
Author Message
Tom
Admin



Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 16438 | TRs

Tom
  Top

Admin
PostThu Feb 06, 2020 7:34 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Yes, it's just an excuse to post politics which is not allowed here.  What am I missing?  Has nothing to do with a anyone hitting a sparrow with their car.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Bernardo
Member
Member


Joined: 08 Feb 2010
Posts: 2092 | TRs
Location: out and about in the world
Bernardo
  Top

Member
PostThu Feb 06, 2020 9:02 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
This weekend while I was driving to hike, a hawk of some kind swooped just feet from my windshield.  I think it was gliding in to pounce on something on the other side of the road.  It paid no notice to me and my car and was completely focused on the attack.  It must take a lot of concentration to catch prey to eat, but that focus alnost cost thus bird it's life. It happened in an instant, but I got a rate good look of a wild bird of prey.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
Ski
><((((°>



Joined: 28 May 2005
Posts: 10920 | TRs
Location: tacoma
Ski
  Top

><((((°>
PostThu Feb 06, 2020 9:42 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
^ Red-Tail hawks perch on the light poles along the freeways to spot mice and other critters whose homes are in the freeway medians. I see them quite often on the 6th Avenue on-ramp to eastbound Hwy 16.

--------------
"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach. 
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Tom
Admin



Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 16438 | TRs

Tom
  Top

Admin
PostThu Feb 06, 2020 10:31 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Well, it wan't posted in Stewardship.  First thing that seemed odd was why a "climate news" blog was posting that opinion piece.  Then again they are a clearing house for think tank news.  One concern is raised in the American Bird Conservancy quote that Randy posted:

American Bird Conservancy wrote:
At 100, Successful Law is Under Attack
In a legal opinion issued December 2017, the Administration abruptly reversed decades of government policy and practice — by both Democratic and Republican administrations — on the implementation and enforcement of the MBTA. The Act's prohibition on the killing or "taking" of migratory birds has long been understood to extend to “incidental take” — meaning unintentional, but predictable and avoidable, killing from threats such as oil pits that trap birds, and tall towers and power lines responsible for many bird collisions. Under the Administration's revised interpretation, the MBTA's protections will apply only to activities that purposefully kill birds. Any incidental take — no matter how inevitable, avoidable, or devastating its impact on birds — is now immune from enforcement under the law.

Other dissenting opinions:

The Migratory Bird Treaty Act, Explained

17 Former Federal Officials to Zinke: Don't Change the Migratory Bird Treaty Act

More than 500 Organizations in All 50 States Urge Congress to Defend Bird Protection Law
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Malachai Constant
Member
Member


Joined: 13 Jan 2002
Posts: 14584 | TRs
Location: Back Again Like A Bad Penny
Malachai Constant
  Top

Member
PostThu Feb 06, 2020 11:50 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Just trolling by the usual suspects for the usual reasons. huh.gif

--------------
"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
Ski
><((((°>



Joined: 28 May 2005
Posts: 10920 | TRs
Location: tacoma
Ski
  Top

><((((°>
PostFri Feb 07, 2020 12:04 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
gives y'all somethin' to do when the weather's so crappy! lol.gif

--------------
"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach. 
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Kascadia
Member
Member


Joined: 03 Feb 2014
Posts: 454 | TRs

Kascadia
  Top

Member
PostFri Feb 07, 2020 12:20 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Introduced January 8, 2020

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/116/hr5552

And Audubon's reporting on the bill:

https://www.audubon.org/news/audubon-congress-must-pass-new-bird-protection-bill

--------------
It is as though I had read a divine text, written into the world itself, not with letters but rather with essential objects, saying:
Man, stretch thy reason hither, so thou mayest comprehend these things. Johannes Kepler
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
Pyrites
Member
Member


Joined: 16 Sep 2014
Posts: 1277 | TRs
Location: South Sound
Pyrites
  Top

Member
PostFri Feb 07, 2020 11:14 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
I’ve got a brother who forwards Watts Up stuff when he’s been drinking but is still able to stand up.

Writes high on rant, low own reason, material.

He doesn’t meet current standards for science writers of disclosure of funding sources.

Best.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
MtnGoat
Member
Member


Joined: 17 Dec 2001
Posts: 12000 | TRs
Location: Lyle, WA
MtnGoat
  Top

Member
PostFri Feb 07, 2020 12:51 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
And that's perfectly reasonable, and reforms which make it impossible be used against individuals with respect to accidents are good ones. Improving law so often means focusing it.

--------------
Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
Cyclopath
Faster than light



Joined: 20 Mar 2012
Posts: 4152 | TRs
Location: Seattle
Cyclopath
  Top

Faster than light
PostFri Feb 07, 2020 12:54 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
catsp wrote:
Some people are apparently okay with an incredibly over broad (interpretation of) law that criminalizes their own behavior because they're confident they won't actually be prosecuted. In truth, I'm not particularly concerned myself with prosecution for accidentally collecting migrating birds in the grill of my car.

Of all the things to worry about or put energy into changing, the worry that federal detectives are going to track you down for hitting a finch with your car isn't even in the top thousand.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
Tom
Admin



Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 16438 | TRs

Tom
  Top

Admin
PostFri Feb 07, 2020 1:49 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Why do you think they re-wrote the law among all other priorities?  Concern over individual liberties?  The terms hoodwinked and bamboozled come to mind.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Cyclopath
Faster than light



Joined: 20 Mar 2012
Posts: 4152 | TRs
Location: Seattle
Cyclopath
  Top

Faster than light
PostFri Feb 07, 2020 2:01 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Tom wrote:
Why do you think they re-wrote the law among all other priorities?  Concern over individual liberties?  The terms hoodwinked and bamboozled come to mind.

Probably to allow some factory to pollute some waterway used by migratory birds.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
Tom
Admin



Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 16438 | TRs

Tom
  Top

Admin
PostFri Feb 07, 2020 3:14 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
OK, so the law has simply been reinterpreted.  No individual liberties have actually been protected.  If you're worried 'bout them coming after you for incidental take I'd think you still need to be afraid, very afraid!

According to the opposition, this legal opinion prevents enforcement of all incidental take, removing incentives for companies to adopt practices that protect birds from threats such as oil waste pits. It also eliminates penalties for companies that kill substantial numbers of birds, including from large oil spills.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Ski
><((((°>



Joined: 28 May 2005
Posts: 10920 | TRs
Location: tacoma
Ski
  Top

><((((°>
PostFri Feb 07, 2020 3:19 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Tom wrote:
The terms hoodwinked and bamboozled come to mind.

That is a given concerning anything having anything to do with Zinke or any of his co-conspirators.

This thread should be in Stewardship.

--------------
"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach. 
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
catsp
Member
Member


Joined: 15 Jun 2017
Posts: 83 | TRs

catsp
  Top

Member
PostFri Feb 07, 2020 4:21 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Tom wrote:
OK, so the law has simply been reinterpreted.  No individual liberties have actually been protected.  If you're worried 'bout them coming after you for incidental take I'd think you still need to be afraid, very afraid!

Why is there a need to completely ignore or mischaracterize what someone writes? I've tried very hard to be clear on the points I've tried to make (and what I'm not saying as well). Maybe my observations have merit, maybe they don't. But I'm perplexed by the insistence on mischaracterizing them or otherwise responding as if they're specious.

I specifically said (this will be the third time) that I had no fear of being prosecuted for accidentally and incidentally killing a bird (migratory or otherwise)
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
  Display:     All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Forum Index > Public Lands Stewardship > Federal Prosecution for hitting a bird with your car?
Jump to:   
Search this topic:

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
   Use Disclaimer Powered by phpBB Privacy Policy