Forum Index > Trail Talk > MB/S NF no longer gives road or trail conditions
Previous :: Next Topic  
Author Message
kitya
Member
Member


Joined: 15 Mar 2010
Posts: 488 | TRs

kitya
  Top

Member
PostTue May 19, 2020 6:04 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
The new fancy map works for me, but it is clearly very much not up to date. Lots of roads say they are still snowed in, but they are not.

https://usfs.maps.arcgis.com/apps/MapSeries/index.html?appid=2f5351d70b0d4ed9b13d372e9d109fcb
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
Malachai Constant
Member
Member


Joined: 13 Jan 2002
Posts: 14589 | TRs
Location: Back Again Like A Bad Penny
Malachai Constant
  Top

Member
PostTue May 19, 2020 6:08 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
It is kind of like video news stories unless it is a volcano erupting or a tsunami I do not need a video as I can read. Just another excuse to add ads.

--------------
"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
neek
Member
Member


Joined: 12 Sep 2011
Posts: 1154 | TRs
Location: Seattle, WA
neek
  Top

Member
PostTue May 19, 2020 6:41 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
monorail wrote:
So far I've tried it on an android phone and an ipad, on several different browsers, and I cannot get it to work at all. Usually it crashes the browser, or freezes until I close the browser. At best I can see the map with a tiny sliver of text to the left, but I cannot scroll the text or see anything useful.

Works ok on my old Pixel 2 but does eventually crash the browser tab.  Slightly easier to navigate if you click the icon in the lower right corner to expand to full screen, but still awkward on a phone.  Much better experience on a desktop machine.  Too bad the list is gone but I guess that would just be one more thing to maintain.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
HikerJohn
Member
Member


Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Posts: 268 | TRs
Location: Daydreaming
HikerJohn
  Top

Member
PostWed May 20, 2020 8:43 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
monorail wrote:
So far I've tried it on an android phone and an ipad, on several different browsers, and I cannot get it to work at all. Usually it crashes the browser, or freezes until I close the browser. At best I can see the map with a tiny sliver of text to the left, but I cannot scroll the text or see anything useful.

Is anyone else experiencing this, or are you able to actually access useful information? I'm thinking this new page requires a specific browser/OS on a shiny new flagship device with 32gb of RAM or something. They used to have a simple list of roads and trails with their conditions, in simple text, easily accessible on any device.


Mono, I managed to access it and pull up maps with Firefox, Windows Edge, and SOMEWHAT on my android phone (it takes a long time to load up).

I have provided feedback and told them it may be worthwhile to also just have a list view...
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
mb
Member
Member


Joined: 11 Aug 2002
Posts: 491 | TRs

mb
  Top

Member
PostWed May 20, 2020 10:19 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
The map is probably way more useful for most people.

It should however at least give a date of report. E.g. "Snowed in as of 1/5/20" is very different from "Snowed in as of 5/1/20". (Never mind the question of MM/DD or DD/MM).
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
Joey
verrry senior member



Joined: 05 Jun 2005
Posts: 2274 | TRs
Location: Redmond
Joey
  Top

verrry senior member
PostWed May 20, 2020 4:05 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
monorail wrote:
So, it appears Baker-Snoqualmie NF has a fancy new interactive road/trail conditions page:

https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/mbs/alerts-notices/?cid=stelprdb5126323


This works on my PC with Firefox.
That  trail data is hosted at:

https://services1.arcgis.com/gGHDlz6USftL5Pau/ArcGIS/rest/services/TrailConditionsMBS/FeatureServer

I tried displaying that data with my GISsurfer web map.
My map sends the correct tile call to their GIS server.
The server sends the expected GeoJSON back to GISsurfer.
But for some weird reason the data never renders on the map.

Some GIS data depends on a feature ESRI calls "Arcade".  Alas, the Leaflet map API (used by GISsurfer) does not habla Arcade.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
monorail
Member
Member


Joined: 06 May 2012
Posts: 260 | TRs

monorail
  Top

Member
PostWed May 20, 2020 6:15 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
I'm curious, for those of you who are able to view it: does it just show the map, with color-coding to indicate open/closed/snow-covered status? Or can you click on the map to get more detailed info about a specific road or trail?

Okanogan-Wenatchee NF still has the old text format (which Baker-Snoqualmie used until recently): https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/okawen/alerts-notices/?cid=stelprdb5400274.  This seems so wonderful to me: detailed information, clearly presented, minimal bandwidth requirement, works beautifully on any device...   all the things we abandon in the name of "progress."
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Joey
verrry senior member



Joined: 05 Jun 2005
Posts: 2274 | TRs
Location: Redmond
Joey
  Top

verrry senior member
PostWed May 20, 2020 7:34 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
If you click that new USFS GIS map you get a popup with some info.
Example:

Road Name: SUNRISE MINE
Road Number 4065
Condition Closed
Notes Inaccessible due to Mt Loop seasonal closure.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Joey
verrry senior member



Joined: 05 Jun 2005
Posts: 2274 | TRs
Location: Redmond
Joey
  Top

verrry senior member
PostWed May 20, 2020 7:52 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
This is one of the best USFS GIS maps that I have seen.

You can change the basemap to FS Topo.
Zoom in for lots of detail
Controls across the top let you turn on a sidebar with a clickable trail list.

This type of map will likely not work on some phones.  These ESRI 'story' maps make a boatload of calls to servers.  If you know how to look at network traffic via your browser you can see what I mean.

There is other useful data the USFS has but which is not (at least) part of this map.
For example the FS has a GIS layer that shows trailheads.  If you click a trailhead then you see a popup that includes a link to the trail description.

Here is a map where you can play with that feature.
https://mappingsupport.com/p2/gissurfer.php?center=47.423500,-121.573248&zoom=14&basemap=FSTopo&overlay=Trail_yellow,Trail_black,Recreation_site&txtfile=https://mappingsupport.com/p2/special_maps/recreation/USFS_recreation.txt
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Seattle_Wayne
Member
Member


Joined: 12 Nov 2019
Posts: 18 | TRs
Location: Greater Snohomish County
Seattle_Wayne
  Top

Member
PostThu May 21, 2020 10:15 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Beckler River Road? I was in that area a month ago- FS6066- road is clear up to Jennifer Dunn trailhead. No snow, road is clear of all blow downs.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
puzzlr
Mid Fork Rocks



Joined: 13 Feb 2007
Posts: 6656 | TRs
Location: Stuck in the middle
puzzlr
  Top

Mid Fork Rocks
PostThu May 21, 2020 11:16 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Joey wrote:
This is one of the best USFS GIS maps that I have seen.

I can agree if you are talking about the tools and not the content. It's a pretty good presentation. But ...

As others have pointed out, this is not being kept current. There are other problems too
- Some trails are completely missing
- Trails that were removed from the USFS years ago show up (they're not maintained)
- Some driveable roads are missing
- Road-to-trail conversions done 10 years ago are still shown as a road
- It has the common problem of the world ending at the borders of the National Forest

I sure wouldn't want to plan a trip based on the information on this map

--------------
Mid Fork Rocks flickr
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Mike Collins
Member
Member


Joined: 18 Dec 2001
Posts: 2671 | TRs

Mike Collins
  Top

Member
PostFri May 22, 2020 5:50 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Joey...Your map is the first one in over a hundred years that has Bald Eagle Peak and Silver Eagle Peak correctly labeled. The current USGS map has it labeled wrong. Your map agrees with Beckey's CAG who had it right all along.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Joey
verrry senior member



Joined: 05 Jun 2005
Posts: 2274 | TRs
Location: Redmond
Joey
  Top

verrry senior member
PostFri May 22, 2020 9:01 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Once upon a time, 'lo those many years ago, many of us who are now senior citizens planned trips and navigated with paper 7.5" USGS topo maps.  Those maps were not perfect and some were woefully out of date.  But we understood the limitations of those maps and that's what we used since they were generally the most detailed maps available.

Fast forward to now and the advances in mapping made possible by GIS.

The FS Topo maps are produced by taking data from many different GIS layers.  Think of each of these layers as a 'snapshot' of the data.  And the snapshots might be taken at different points in time.  All of these layers are combined into a single image which is then 'tiled' so you can see a seemless map on your screen as you pan around.

I do not know how often the FS Topo maps are 'rebuilt' using the freshest data from the component GIS layers.

But if you want to look at the FS Topo maps and then turn on the most recent public GIS data from the USFS, then check out the GISsurfer map link I posted Wednesday.  You can turn on/off/restack GIS layers for open roads, closed roads, etc.  if you need help, please click "Map tips" in the upper left corner.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
puzzlr
Mid Fork Rocks



Joined: 13 Feb 2007
Posts: 6656 | TRs
Location: Stuck in the middle
puzzlr
  Top

Mid Fork Rocks
PostFri May 22, 2020 11:06 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Mike Collins wrote:
Your map is the first one in over a hundred years that has Bald Eagle Peak and Silver Eagle Peak correctly labeled

The upside of user-contributed data -- the names were added correctly in 2009. This is the data that shows up in my Gaia GPS App using the default Gaia topo map.
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=14/47.6035/-121.2875&layers=C

And Joey -- I was talking about the content on the USFS map, not GISSurfer which as you said, has very flexible layer options.

--------------
Mid Fork Rocks flickr
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
  Display:     All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Forum Index > Trail Talk > MB/S NF no longer gives road or trail conditions
  Happy Birthday iluka, ADAHY!
Jump to:   
Search this topic:

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
   Use Disclaimer Powered by phpBB Privacy Policy