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Randito
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PostFri Feb 12, 2021 11:55 pm 
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I posted specific information on timber sales and provided a link to a USFS website documenting these sales.  That's evidence.

You've just been posting speculation and opinion.
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brineal
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PostSat Feb 13, 2021 10:02 pm 
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Randito wrote:
I posted specific information on timber sales and provided a link to a USFS website documenting these sales.  That's evidence.

You've just been posting speculation and opinion.

Confidence interval...zero 😂 blah blah blah
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Slugman
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PostMon Feb 15, 2021 4:53 am 
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Brineal says “none”, Randito easily shows that to be nonsense, now Brineal has devolved into childish denial. So either 3,000+ acres in one NF is nothing, or Brineal is deliberately lying. Another one for the ignore list.

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Sky Hiker
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PostMon Feb 15, 2021 5:54 am 
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This is just from my personal experience. The timber sale process now takes a lot more time and money than it used to of coarse. The turn around time between setting up a timber sale, going thru all the permits, public input (both general and Tribal), putting the contracts out(a lot more expensive for many reasons i.e. transportation to mills is further), and actual harvest. The turn around time used to be in year terms and now its years.
A prime example is a unit harvested up the Beckler river a few years ago that the USFS did. It was a timber sale to harvest timber because of bug infestation. It still took several years for it to be harvested even when it was to benefit a more healthy timber in the area. As a result of the extended time it took too harvest the bug infestation was increased out of the timber sale boundary. Now another sale would have to be done in hopes to hope to contain the infestation that has spread. This probably won't happen due to the time it took for the original sale to take place along with personnel (Foresters outside the Ranger District have to be brought into to set up the sale), etc. The new process the USFS must go thru(good or bad depending on your view) now discourages timber harvest.
A timber sale and harvest is a win, win situation for the wildlife. In the hey days when the USFS was doing more harvesting the wildlife population in the area was booming. It opened the forest up to more browse available allowing for a larger population to survive...
This is just my experience in my local area but sure it would be the same in other districts. Now the process for public land harvest thru the states(DNR) forest practices permit system takes a lot less time and money.
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Randito
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PostMon Feb 15, 2021 10:40 am 
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Yes, those whose are employed in the timber industry or in towns that have or had significant timber employment as part of their economy feel there is too much paperwork,  planing and process involved in timber sales.

Upton Sinclair wrote:
It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it. 
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brineal
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PostTue Feb 16, 2021 8:02 pm 
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Randito wrote:
Yes, those whose are employed in the timber industry or in towns that have or had significant timber employment as part of their economy feel there is too much paperwork,  planing and process involved in timber sales.

Timber towns don’t get it blah blah blah
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brineal
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PostThu Feb 18, 2021 2:46 pm 
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Slugman wrote:
Brineal says “none”, Randito easily shows that to be nonsense, now Brineal has devolved into childish denial. So either 3,000+ acres in one NF is nothing, or Brineal is deliberately lying. Another one for the ignore list.

You must mean this? there is almost no activity going on except for state and private.

Ooze your way out of here sluggo.
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Randito
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PostFri Feb 19, 2021 9:07 pm 
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brineal wrote:
You must mean this? there is almost no activity going on except for state and private.

Isn't it funny how some people believe they are entitled to earn a living harvesting a resource from publicly owned land.   In the extreme case, The Bundy bunch -- they think they are entitled to graze their cattle on public land and not even pay the grazing fees.
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Randito
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PostSat Feb 20, 2021 8:13 am 
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timberghost wrote:
They pay to recieve a permit to graze

Not the Bundy Bunch.   https://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-cliven-bundy-fines-20160107-story.html

On the issue of timber sales the attitude seems to be that timber workers are entitled to harvest publicly owned timber and do so with bothering to do the environmental protection steps required by the National Environmental Policy Act in a manner that is legally defensible.
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timberghost
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PostSat Feb 20, 2021 8:35 am 
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So where do you get this so called "attitude" of timber workers. I don't at this feeling at all and I am from a timber town. If it is a federal timber sale the feds go thru most of the permits and processes before it is even started to be logged. The logging timber company has to adhere to what's in the contact other wise there is fines. They operate on a fine line as far as profit. Private timberlands is a different process. So your perception is pretty much in your head. They are some of the hardest working people around and put in a honest days work. You should be so honest.
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Randito
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PostSat Feb 20, 2021 8:50 am 
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timberghost wrote:
So where do you get this so called "attitude" of timber workers.

Apparently we are reading different threads.   The thread I've been reading it filled with complaints about USFS land managers being unwilling to make timber sales for fear of lawsuits.
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timberghost
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PostSat Feb 20, 2021 9:42 am 
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I believe your wrong. The threats of lawsuits is not what is keeping federal timber sales. As much as it is the lack of qualified personell in the different ranger districts to set up the sales and go thru the process. The process the district's have to go thru to set up and do sale is comprised so their won't be lawsuits. I think you will find very few lawsuits resulting from an approved and performed sale. Thus consideration for a lawsuit resulting from a timber sale is minimal at best.
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Randito
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PostSat Feb 20, 2021 9:46 am 
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timberghost wrote:
I believe your wrong. The threats of lawsuits is not what is keeping federal timber sales. As much as it is the lack of qualified personell in the different ranger districts to set up the sales and go thru the process. The process the district's have to go thru to set up and do sale is comprised so their won't be lawsuits. I think you will find very few lawsuits resulting from an approved and performed sale. Thus consideration for a lawsuit resulting from a timber sale is minimal at best.

Thanks for effectively refuting the complaints of OP and the others that have been complaining about lack of timber sales.
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brineal
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PostSat Feb 20, 2021 7:21 pm 
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Randito wrote:
Isn't it funny how some people believe they are entitled to earn a living harvesting a resource from publicly owned land.   In the extreme case, The Bundy bunch -- they think they are entitled to graze their cattle on public land and not even pay the grazing fees.

Kind of a tangent but I agree with you the Bundys had no ground to stand on and were utterly ridiculous in their protests.

I actually find it very bizarre which people in gov’t hold decidedly anti-federal lands positions.
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Randito
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PostSun Feb 21, 2021 7:59 am 
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brineal wrote:
I actually find it very bizarre which people in gov’t hold decidedly anti-federal lands positions.

The OP indicates that there are big bucks to be made by creating a public interest non-profit, hiring attorney's on contingency and suing the USFS -- sounds like a business opportunity for under employed timber workers.
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