Forum Index > Trail Talk > milk creek trail, pipeline, lime ridge
Previous :: Next Topic  
Author Message
Backpacker Joe
NWH Joe-Bob



Joined: 16 Dec 2001
Posts: 23634 | TRs
Location: Cle Elum
Backpacker Joe
  Top

NWH Joe-Bob
PostFri Jul 14, 2017 7:59 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
geyer wrote:
Backpacker Joe wrote:
Don Geyer

No relation... though he does take some quality photos  up.gif

That he does.  I'm sorry for making the connection.  Don is a great guy.

--------------
"If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide."

Abraham Lincoln
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
hetrekker
Member
Member


Joined: 31 Aug 2015
Posts: 121 | TRs

hetrekker
  Top

Member
PostSat Jul 15, 2017 10:20 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
"begging to be explored" - oh yeah, you nailed it, geyer. We plan on getting up there at least 5 more times this season by different routes and different ridgelines. "strange creature .....maps for fun" - just like me DAILY; I've almost memorized every contour line on every ridge headed up there, and can visualize every open and canopied spot on all the ridges. To clarify, my thoughts were not personal zingers aimed at you, but an appeal to the heart of this forum, where well meaning communication (and photo spreads) can lead to unintended consequences in this age of social media. Each individual here develops their own set of convictions in regard to what they share; there is no fixed right or wrong here for everyone. I was just throwing out some ideas to consider. Looking forward to hearing about your route choices and your impressions, geyer.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
hetrekker
Member
Member


Joined: 31 Aug 2015
Posts: 121 | TRs

hetrekker
  Top

Member
PostSat Jul 15, 2017 4:57 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
If anyone wants more details on the shortcomings of the Pipeline trail, let me know.

Our route up to box started after crossing the new log; looking up, there was a rising ridge to the left, a rising ridge to the right and a jungle infested ravine between. We chose the right ridge. Heading up it didn't take long to realize this was the wrong ridge; a long vertical wall of rock wedged us over to the left to an ever steepening sidehill. We managed to squeak past this wall and ended up on a flat spot, looking up at a green vertical wall of jungle embedded on a steep slope. It is at this point on every trip up here that all willpower leaves us and we ask each other whether we should turn back. Our plan had been to head straight up just east of where box creek took a hard left turn, right where the contour lines are the most spaced; however, we were too far east by now. There are on this main ridge rising to box a number of shallow dry ravines and flats that cut across the ridge, rise gently to the sse, and disappear. On other trips we would cross these and continue on in a straight line, but now we abandoned this method along with our plan, and decided to follow these ravines sse until they disappeared then head straight up. Using this technique some positive results were experienced: the end of the ravine became a natural waypoint from which to get our bearings on future trips; all but the lowest elevation ravine were free of jungle, providing a mental and physical break from the climb, and making for a great rest stop; it also exposed us to some cheerful intermittent sun and provided us with some actual views; though slightly steeper on the climb than other routes the tough moss groundcover acted like a living crampon grabbing our trail shoe soles, giving us a feeling of safety, and allowing us to relax; and perhaps best of all was the near absence of brush and jungle and thus the ease of movement and ability to get a clear line of sight. More later.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Backpacker Joe
NWH Joe-Bob



Joined: 16 Dec 2001
Posts: 23634 | TRs
Location: Cle Elum
Backpacker Joe
  Top

NWH Joe-Bob
PostSat Jul 15, 2017 7:17 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
I'm curious, what's the reason for trying new routes up to the ridge?  If the original fishermen's route still exists and it works why not use that?  Is it that bad, that you want to find something else?  Do you not want to use is so as to keep it from becoming more pronounced?  I fully understand your passion for the ridge and area.  That said, it isnt as if people will be using helicopters to fly in there and therefore abuse it.  Anyone going there STILL has to hike up there.

--------------
"If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide."

Abraham Lincoln
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
hetrekker
Member
Member


Joined: 31 Aug 2015
Posts: 121 | TRs

hetrekker
  Top

Member
PostSun Jul 16, 2017 12:07 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Hi, Joe-Bob. Like everyone else, I have personal reasons for doing what I do and have never felt a need to satisfy someone else's curiosity as to what those reasons are. Your having come to different conclusions on the pipeline trail and the ridge is plenty ok with me, and I'm happy for you. Best of luck to you up there.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
JCK
Member
Member


Joined: 10 Jun 2017
Posts: 3 | TRs
Location: Seattle
JCK
  Top

Member
PostSun Jul 16, 2017 9:59 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
hetrekker wrote:
If anyone wants more details on the shortcomings of the Pipeline trail, let me know.

I'd certainly be curious to hear your thoughts on the trail. If there is a compelling reason to avoid it, I'm not opposed to sniffing out my own way up to the ridge as you have done.

thanks!
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
hetrekker
Member
Member


Joined: 31 Aug 2015
Posts: 121 | TRs

hetrekker
  Top

Member
PostSun Jul 16, 2017 1:37 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
JCK. Nothing compelling just preference from knowledge and experience gained from 5x up to box and 4x down from there since 2015. [Note to all: there is absolutely no desire on this end to convince or debate merits of what is best (there isn't a best for everyone) on this or anything else. Not interested in engaging in argument of any sort, though I very much enjoy, appreciate, and welcome opinions that vary from mine. The keys are how respectful, gracious, and open we are to others reasons and preferences. With these elements we become a fun and supportive collective brain trust that values each person's input whether we agree or not. In life, there never really is a consensus on "best", just personal choices to be made or changed]. We did the pipeline trail up and down 3 of those times. JCK, "IF" you can find and follow the entire trail to the first box meadow the pipe is a fine way to go up. 2 drawbacks: if you lose the trail it is absolutely the worst place on the ridge to be at - steep and jungley. The level of experience and natural savvy of each individual enters in as a big determining factor. Second, time to retrace and find the trail yet again can easily accumulate into hours with no guarantee of success. There are a few devious and unexpected direction changes amazingly camouflaged that you can easily blow by: tight wraparound an uphill tree with change of direction; sharp 90 degree turn pushing thru heavy, leafy cover; sudden jump up on the side to a different level in brush that you can't even tell by looking at it until you have gone a bit further; multiple trails that converge that might require vetting each; and more if I can think of them. Now all this applies to going downhill plus: descending very steep root and dirt sections where every stepdown needs to be tested; hard, sloped needle sections that can be very slick; one unarrested slip and you are super screwed on the two long, nearly vertical sections. We find these sections scary even with 10# packs; there are two well camouflaged left turns that are pivotal to keeping on trail as you descend into heavy cover(rivord creek will be audible); when you miss the first turn you will be facing a small pile of branches with no visible trail. Back up and make your way left. Within thirty feet or so you'll spot a trail on the right mostly covered with stiff leafy plants from the side. Probably within 5 minutes of descent on this trail you could miss the next left turn; trail bed sort of disappears and travel becomes awkward. Back up, and patiently poke your nose and eyes into the brush on the left. Hidden in there is the almost invisible entrance to the chute. If you had climbed to box by this trail you know what I mean by the "chute". Miss these 2 turns and you will be in hell for the next one to two hours. More later.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
hetrekker
Member
Member


Joined: 31 Aug 2015
Posts: 121 | TRs

hetrekker
  Top

Member
PostSun Jul 16, 2017 5:08 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Just a few trail notes before we head up there again: It took us 6 hours to box lake from the car by bushwhacking straight up. We each carried 2.5 liters of water containing half strength blue Gatorade (purchased at Costco) and we think it helps. I dehydrated early and ended up drinking only 2 liters. There is for me a psychological tendency to conserve on drinking early for fear of running out. You may have to fight this urge too, as it is irrational. The first fourth of elevation gain takes 2/5ths of the time and energy to get to first box meadow (where there is water and it is relatively flat for the half hour to box lake). The upper 3/4ths of the climb feels much faster and easier. 2 hardboiled eggs and a bratwurst each sustained us on the climb. Protein and fats are our preference; alternatives include hard cheese and triscuits, cashews. Besides water weight, our packs weigh 10# max including food. Because of my age, weight, and health, going light is essential to make it up there, and it may be important to you too. Medium weight trail shoes with spaced lug pattern work well for us. There was no snow anywhere on the climb. Once in box meadow (5000) there was a grand total of app. 40' of nearly melted out snow crossing the trail, and there was no snow at the lake. Lime mountain at 6772 was melted out but for one chute and a dip, and best I could tell should be a snow free climb from upper rivord. Happy climbing.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Backpacker Joe
NWH Joe-Bob



Joined: 16 Dec 2001
Posts: 23634 | TRs
Location: Cle Elum
Backpacker Joe
  Top

NWH Joe-Bob
PostSun Jul 16, 2017 5:27 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Thanks for all the great information HET. up.gif

If anyone that has done the pipeline has a GPS route Id sure appreciate taking a look at it. hockeygrin.gif

--------------
"If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide."

Abraham Lincoln
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
hetrekker
Member
Member


Joined: 31 Aug 2015
Posts: 121 | TRs

hetrekker
  Top

Member
PostTue Jul 18, 2017 12:41 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
A few more thoughts on the pipe. There is one variable salvation on the pipe, and that is flags. Last year, some well-meaning person wearing caulked boots did a very thorough job placing red flags to the lake. It made getting up there drama free. From my perspective it made it too easy, and for us depleted enjoyment of the journey up. The mental struggle to attaining the ridge plays a much larger role in developing respect and appreciation of the ridge than does the physical effort. The journey up is a natural barrier to keep people that shouldn't be there out of there. Flags can thwart that natural vetting. All those red flags were gone this year. Though we didn't take the pipe up we chose to take it down so we could report back to you on its condition. After starting the descent from the first box meadow, we came across 2 or 3 five foot long orange flags hanging down to the ground. After that, typical length ones started to appear, far apart and intelligently and strategically placed. Note: some of these were placed where a camouflaged or unexpected change of direction was not obvious. If faint, but obvious trail can't be seen at one of these, look around for a trail change of direction. At 2 or 3 places on the way down, I tied an itsy bitsy orange bowtie at critical points to add clarity to direction change; the most important one was at the hidden entrance to the chute heading down. Counting on flags in not dependable as they may have been removed or deliberately moved to sidetrack your following them. We did find one misplaced one within a half hour of the trailhead on our way down. It was well off the trail we were following; I detoured to check it out and found no evidence of a trail anywhere - I left it there. I returned to shetrekker to follow our current trail and after a bit the widely spaced orange flags continued down the last slope. If these flags remain, they are excellent training wheels to develop self dependent trail finding and following skills.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Backpacker Joe
NWH Joe-Bob



Joined: 16 Dec 2001
Posts: 23634 | TRs
Location: Cle Elum
Backpacker Joe
  Top

NWH Joe-Bob
PostTue Jul 18, 2017 7:30 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Thanks for all your attention and help HET. up.gif

--------------
"If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide."

Abraham Lincoln
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
AlpineRose
Member
Member


Joined: 08 May 2012
Posts: 1954 | TRs

AlpineRose
  Top

Member
PostWed Jul 19, 2017 12:31 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
With the amount of time the trekkers are spending in this area comes an intimate knowledge of this particular small slice of our planet.  In a way, it reminds me of the time Thoreau spent at Walden Pond.  I can see how it would be very satisfying.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Silas
Member
Member


Joined: 14 Aug 2012
Posts: 37 | TRs

Silas
  Top

Member
PostSun Mar 07, 2021 4:29 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Great thread to read while it hails here in Seattle. How does the pipeline compare to the approach up Blum? Seems like a great trip to bring the rod!
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
   All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Forum Index > Trail Talk > milk creek trail, pipeline, lime ridge
  Happy Birthday Tall Hiker Man!
Jump to:   
Search this topic:

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
   Use Disclaimer Powered by phpBB Privacy Policy