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Amothy
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Location: Kent, WA
Amothy
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PostSat Sep 23, 2006 1:16 pm 
Though I'm not new to hiking, I am to backpacking. This summer I took my first extended trip - the Wonderland Trail. I'm not sure if the rangers were impressed or thought I was crazy. Anyhow, I'm learning as I go and trying to abide by Leave No Trace and all that good stuff. However, I ran into a dilemma this summer that I hope the experts - that would be you guys - can clear up for me. Please, nobody shoot when I admit that I did all my washing in the streams. frown.gif It was an honest mistake. No one was kind enough to say, "Hey, why are you doing your dishes and laundry in our water supply?" I just didn't know. I asked around before I went, but none of the hikers I talked to said anything about it. (I did use biodegradable soap, however.) After I got back, I settled in with a copy of Backpacker Magazine and was horrified to learn that I should never have done what I did. Like I said, I'm learning. Anyway, I'm in a bit of a quandry about how to handle such things on the trips I take next year. I've got some books, but no one seems to offer clear advice on exactly what to do. And sometimes the info they give contradicts itself. For example, my bear book says not wash dishes in camp because the smell of the food particles could attract bears. However, all other info I've found indicates that dishes should be washed in camp - 100 feet away from the tent - and the water should be scattered. But campsites up at Mt. Rainier aren't generally that big and of all the very experienced backpackers we met, we never saw anyone leave their site to do dishes. So should you just wash up in camp, fling your water in an arc, and not worry about curious bears? Advice on this quandry would be appreciated. Also, if one does not wash laundry in the stream, how do you get it clean? And how do you wash your hair and get yourself clean? Sorry for the length of this message. And by the way, I packed out ALL my trash and picked up anything I saw that other hikers left behind. I do know a little. smile.gif So advice on these or other matters for a beginner who wants to do it right... Fire away.

Two roads diverged in a wood, and I - I took the one less traveled by, and that has made all the difference. R. Frost
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scm007
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PostSat Sep 23, 2006 2:23 pm 
Yes, just boil some extra water (or use cold) to clean up with after dinner. Walk a ways away and chuck some of it, walk a little more, chuck some more. Or... you can bring a strainer and strain out the food particles, but I always chuck it. Also, if you want people to answer you post on the main page! This is a good question to ask as a lot of beginners wash in streams and lakes.

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jenjen
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jenjen
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PostSat Sep 23, 2006 4:19 pm 
For me, cleanliness is relative in the backcountry. I use soap rarely enough that I usually don't carry it with me. Dishes: I carry my pot to the stream, dip some water out, scrub any stray food bits off with a green scrubby pad while I'm walking away from the stream, and then scatter the water on the ground. I boil water for meals when I fire up the stove, so any stray cooties get sterilized that way. Laundry: I rinse and scrub my socks and undies in the stream or lake and just get them as clean as water and scrubbing alone will get them. They aren't downey fresh, but aren't nearly as smelly and crunchy as if I didn't rinse them out at all. Bathing: My grimy self + a bandanna + stream or lake = backcountry bath. Find a good rock, bank, or just climb on in and give yourself a wipe down with the bandanna. Or go for a swim. No soap. My hair doesn't get shampooed at all - it actually doesn't even get brushed.

If life gives you melons - you might be dyslexic
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Kat
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Kat
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PostSat Sep 23, 2006 4:51 pm 
I am certainly no expert!!! compared to the excellent backpackers on this site. But, I can relate to your conundrum about what to do with the cooking and cleaning stuff. I use filtered water to rinse out our titanium cups (which we cook & eat out of) , and I do it well away from camp. I usually dig a small hole to dump the dirty water in, & cover it up well. The worst thing I have had to deal with so far, is someone left a bunch of dog food on the ground at our selected campsite. I walked about 20 minutes down the trail, dug a big hole, and buried all the crap.

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Rich Baldwin
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Rich Baldwin
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PostSat Sep 23, 2006 5:12 pm 
A cat hole is the best option. Food scraps attract critters.

Was you ever bit by a dead bee?
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bjbear
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bjbear
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PostSat Sep 23, 2006 6:19 pm 
drinking dishwater
I recently read the most current issue of the WTA magazine at the library - they were discussing backpackers drinking their dishwater as a means of disposing of it. Apparently without soap in it, but the thought still made me sort of nauseous..... gag.gif In bear country with lots of backpackers (Chilkoot Trail for example) there are gray water disposal pits in the campgrounds - but you're supposed to strain out the chunks and pack them out. Probably how frequently the campsite is used and how serious the possibility of attracting bears, etc dictates the level of tidiness? In some areas, hikers are required to pack out (ahem) "human waste" too. So I hear.

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johnahl
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johnahl
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PostSat Sep 23, 2006 6:19 pm 
Amothy, Three cheers for you wanting to be a responsible leave no trace hiker. You're on the right track and in the right place to ask questions. I would suggest a lot of monitoring of this group and maybe joining one of the GTG's (get-togethers) that the members have. I have only been to one myself but I had a great time. I think the next one may be a campout in a campground somewhere on the middle fork road sometime around the end of Oct. Most GTG's are posted in the "Full Moon Saloon" section of the group. Welcome aboard. campfire.gif

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Pipsissewa
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PostMon Sep 25, 2006 5:37 pm 
Hi, Amothy, a lot of info can be read here on the Leave No Trace site: http://www.lnt.org/programs/lnt7/index.html Washing yourself can be easy, and this way your body oils and sun screen and Deet and deoderant don't end up floating in a sheen in the lake: scoop up a gallon-sized zip-lock bag of water, go off into the woods with your washcloth and biodegradible soap, or no soap, and scrub yourself. Washing you hair is simple, just lean over and let the dirty-soapy water fall back into the baggie. Shy people can even almost bathe, one body part at a time, remaining fairly covered. If the water gets too dirty for you, go get another bag of it, but dump dirty water into the forest duff, far away from lake or stream, so that it has a chance to be "digested" by microrganisms before reaching the clean water. Most people think this is over-kill, but if you read the reports of human activity contamination in the wilderness, maybe it isn't over-kill. The higher and colder the place, the less microrganism-activity in the soil, maybe it's just better to get okay with dirt! Thanks for caring, too!

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ActionBetty
Im a dirty hippie!



Joined: 06 Jul 2003
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ActionBetty
Im a dirty hippie!
PostTue Sep 26, 2006 7:15 am 
as far as eating, you can cut down on clean up by making your meals in plastic bags (the strong freezer bags), then you can just pack them in the garbage.if you must you can pour a little hot water in them to get rid of food particles and dump away from camp. the only thing I have to clean is my spoon..and good swirl in my cup with some hot water perferably tea works just fine. My clothes just stay crusty or I use Jen jens method of rinseing with no soap in a creek somewhere..rare occasion, I like being a dirty girl.

"If you're not living good, you gotta travel wide"...Bob Marley
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Tazz
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PostTue Sep 26, 2006 8:16 am 
I have never washed my clothes. For me one of the things about being out there is getting dirty which is frowned on in society. I will not get sick from smelly cloths so why wash them. On the wonderland trail we added fresh change of clothes in the 2 caches. So every 3-4 days we had clean cloths. I never jump into cold ass water to bath or swim. I have taken a wash cloth and warmed up some water and taken sponge baths on the trail a few times though. rinse my dish but I have not washed them with soap for over 10 years. Well... when I get home I do biggrin.gif I usually cook something that I don't need a dish for. Soups in a cup and freeze dried crap in a bag. Tea and coffee in a cup and I don't really need to wash that. Easy is best in my book.

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Dante
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PostTue Sep 26, 2006 11:42 am 
I try to minimize dirty cookwear by "cooking" freeze-dried food in the bag, eating out of the pot, etc. I've been known to rinse my pot or cup and dring the water. If you think that's gross, so be it. To heach his (or her) own. I am old enough to remember when Backpacking One Step at a Time recommended "burn, bash and bury" rather than "leave no trace". Back in those days, I discovered that one drop of Biosuds will sink all the water striders in the stream pool where you are doing your dishes. If you break the surface tension, they are doomed. It can't help the other creatures in the stream any, either.

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Gil
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PostTue Sep 26, 2006 12:19 pm 
Never jump into cold-ass water to bathe? I have to. If I see a lake at the end of the day, I swim. Otherwise, I offend my delicate sensibilities. And at the end of the day, I'll also rinse out my 16-year-old Lifa top and then wear it in camp to dry it out. But I don't carry any soap at all. And I try to eat every scrap, every morsel of food out of my bowl to make cleaning easier. You know what REALLY gripes my cookies? When people clean out plates/cups/bowls with RICE on them in a LAKE! So you have all these little maggoty things in the water. Yuck. But Amothy, sounds like you're on the right path!

Friends help the miles go easier. Klahini
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Tazz
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Tazz
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PostTue Sep 26, 2006 1:35 pm 
gaeger wrote:
Never jump into cold-ass water to bathe?
LOL embarassedlaugh.gif No. I have been spoiled by the warm water lakes on the East coast. Water is too damn cold here. Brrrrrrrr biggrin.gif

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Dave Workman
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PostTue Sep 26, 2006 5:07 pm 
Ah, well, in some cases (Jen) maybe that's "a little too much information" biggrin.gif lol.gif But all good stuff. As others have suggested, I boil extra water and rinse out the cookware and dishes. For my frying pan, I just pour water in, and allow that to simmer over the flame for a few minutes. Cleans up just peachy. At least now I'll have a pretty good idea about when any of you guys are, uh, just up around the bend in the trail! lol.gif lol.gif

"The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted." - D.H. Lawrence
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Quark
Niece of Alvy Moore



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Quark
Niece of Alvy Moore
PostTue Sep 26, 2006 6:05 pm 
I don't do laundry either. I've been out as long as 9 days with no more than what I had on my back the first day (I'll nip it in the bud and advise that I use panty liners). No need to wash your hair - just tie it back, or if you have short hair, rinse it in water). If your hair is long, you don't even use a comb, just comb it out with your fingers, and re-put it in a pony tail. I do use my all-purpose handkerchief to dip in water and wipe off grime on special occasions, and I always wipe my face with water in the morning. On rare occasions I take a tiny plastic bottle of Doc Bronner's soap, but more often then not, even when I have it, I don't use it. I usually have handsome clothes waiting for me in the truck at the trailhead, to change into on the way home; at the very least, a handsome shirt. Actually, by mid-summer I'm so used to being outdoors that I can't stand the smell of the sicky-sweet shampoos and soaps and lotions in town, and convert to unscented stuff. By winter I'm back to enjoying fragrances though. I never wash my mess kit. I'll toss some water in the pot, swish it with my fingers, then broadcast the water on foliage away from camp. Perhaps it helps keep the snafflehounds on the perimeter of camp, not in camp. I'm lucky in that my feet don't need babying - I can do with one pair of socks for up to 4 days out, adn they don't have to be clean, so no need to wash 'em. AFter 4 days I'll survive with the one pair, but it's nice to have a non-crunchy, fluffy pair. But if you do use soap to wash dishes, use only a tiny bit. A sump hole is the current accepted method for disposal, (I think - things are always changing).

"...Other than that, the post was more or less accurate." Bernardo, NW Hikers' Bureau Chief of Reporting
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