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Ulrich
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PostWed Mar 06, 2002 7:40 pm 
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The word is that several very vocal and active members of this group actually accompanied her to explore these "hidden
hikes."

Admin note:  apologies but several of the initial posts have disappeared (the imfamous disappearing posts problem shakehead.gif)
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lopper
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PostWed Mar 06, 2002 7:52 pm 
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...and they ain't gonna be 'hidden' for long.  Which is a good thing.  Too many lemming-hikers on the overused trophy trails.

There are tons of great routes out there starving for re-opening.  Maybe this will be the start of a series.

We can submit suggestions.......
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Sawyer
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PostThu Mar 07, 2002 11:15 am 
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A friend showed me a copy he bought yesterday. It does have Troublesome Creek, as well as a bunch of other cool places. And yup, there are recognisable Trailor Trash Talk names mentioned in the tome.
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McPilchuck
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PostThu Mar 07, 2002 1:15 pm 
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eek, gad, I am almost afraid to look at it. Nothing against her or her friends mind you. But sometimes, I worry about those out-of-the-way areas not mentioned in every guide book and being exploited too much...on how to get there. Reminds me of back when I first saw some areas finally put on the map, damn near made me cry.  I guess I shouldn't talk for I have a web site, but I do try to be discreet about routes of how to so to speak.  If it's labled "Hidden" you can bet it won't be much longer...

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in the granite high-wild alpine land . . .
www.alpinequest.com
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REJ
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PostThu Mar 07, 2002 3:02 pm 
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I thumbed through a copy of the book today at Mountaineers Bookstore.  There are 50 trails described from the Olympics and Cascades.  There is a mix of less popular and poorly maintained system trails (e.g., Stetattle Creek,  Huckleberry Mtn (Suiattle), Martin Creek, Barlow Point) abandoned trails (e.g. Ruby Mtn, Newhalem Ck, Kelly Creek) and way routes (e.g. Pilchuck Lakes, Devils Lake, Lake Isabel). Most but not all of the trails have been included in previous guidebooks. No fear there are plenty of hidden trails left to explore.  The text is generally interesting with a nice mix of route and trip descriptions and historical references.  The descriptions are similar in content and style to those found in the author's regular column in the PI.  I will buy a copy to add to my guidebook collection.
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polarbear
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PostThu Mar 07, 2002 7:17 pm 
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I think it's good to publish reports on some of these trails.  Who wants a trail to disappear?  I doubt that any of them will get trampled to death.  Even the troublesome creek trail, though pretty well defined is/was on it's way to obsolescence in my opinion--small pine trees growing up in the center that eventually would create barriers (however, I counted less of them on my way back for some reason...).

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...and a window that looks out on Corcovado...  Corcovado Hill
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Concerned dad of a native
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PostFri Mar 08, 2002 2:18 pm 
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This may not be a popular notion to this group, but it seems to me that you all very much enjoy the wilderness.  It’s a commodity we will someday run out of.

You and I have been lucky to live in an era when we still had wild country.  You appreciate that it is healthy for our bodies and minds to enjoy whatever remaining undisturbed true wilderness is still left out there.  The thought of a no-brainer trail to “everywhere” and no wilderness for future generations to explore seems unfair.  

Plastic flags, blazes, spray paint, etc. have a significant negative impact on the backcountry and turn our Washington wilderness into something less than pristine and challenging.  

Those who would drive trails up every unmarked valley and ridge in our wonderful state take away the spirit of exploration that others thrive on.  The thought of Azure Lake by trail, Silver Lake by trail, the Picket Traverse by trail is, well, Troublesome.  Will it come to that?

Please, do not mark a wilderness route.
Remove marking left by other parties.
Leave no trace.

Thanks for your consideration.
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McPilchuck
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PostFri Mar 08, 2002 3:37 pm 
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I tend to agree with the Concerned Dad, and though some won't see eye to eye with me (that's fine) but I hate to see books in print disclosing some of those way routes that haven't been talked about, flagged or marked too much. Yes, some of them already have been published but when they are written up in the newspapers or in some 100 hikes type guide books, especially with a title of "Hidden" the hordes will descend upon them, and then they become sometimes trampled...and I fear the worst for some of these areas she has described in her new book, some of these places I hold dear to my heart...

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in the granite high-wild alpine land . . .
www.alpinequest.com
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MtnGoat
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PostFri Mar 08, 2002 4:14 pm 
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We need to increase usage to save little used areas from lack of usage, as the argument goes. Then we'll need to decrease usage (with permits) in order to save them from the increased usage which saved them from the lack of usage. Seemingly, saving them by allowing people to find them on their own and keeping the total impact down in the first place, is not a consideration.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
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Sawyer
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PostFri Mar 08, 2002 5:20 pm 
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Weighing in on controversial topics:

There are good reasons why trails get abandoned. The destinations are not as attractive, exciting, safe, or well maintained as the popular destinations. I doubt that they will be mobbed with people. Usage will go up, so hopefully the trails will not be forgotten forever. They will be visited by the very serious hiker who has done the popular trails, or seeks more solitude. On over 80 trips last year, half of them we saw nobody else but our party. So I don't see a big problem looming. The hiking boom of the 70's is waning slightly, even though the population has increased. The Mountaineers are losing population each these days. Maybe things could get worse in the future.

Also, there are so many hiking guidebooks out there, it is unlikely that any will have the impact that the 100 Hikes series had. When 100 Hikes came out, there was no competition, so everybody got the same books and hiked the same places. Yet, even in 100 Hikes, I've seen trails that are rarely travelled. Yes, the hikes off I-90 are very popular. But few go up Marten Creek or Mallardy Ridge for instance.

So not to worry!
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polarbear
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PostFri Mar 08, 2002 7:20 pm 
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Me and a friend hiked to Lake Augusta last summer, I believe on a weekend, and only saw 3 other people, all on there way out.  One guy I swear looked like Frank Sinatra--hat and slacks and about the same age.  He was on his way out at about 11:00--really have to admire that.  We figured he did that hike every Sunday before reading the paper.

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...and a window that looks out on Corcovado...  Corcovado Hill
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#19
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PostFri Mar 08, 2002 7:31 pm 
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We never get far from this topic here do we.  It keeps coming back - just like our boots.

I see both sides of this arguement, but I don't think singing the praises of wilderness or promoting guide books in the name of opening areas will change either sides viewpoint.

The problem is one of increased population.  And this region's isn't going to get smaller soon.  Expect to see more people on more trails and routes.

One of the regulars of this site contacted me off line with some great route info.  I mentioned my appreciation and asked why, enlight of some of the secrecy threads we've had here, he so openly shared route info with me.  Said  he didn't think others needed to waste time and suffer needlesly if he could help.

Like I said, I truely can see both sides.  But I'm leaning towards the more (info) is better side.
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#19
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PostSat Mar 09, 2002 8:30 am 
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Right on.
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catwoman
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PostSat Mar 09, 2002 10:13 am 
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I agree -- right on, Scrooge!  smile.gif
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McPilchuck
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PostSat Mar 09, 2002 10:23 am 
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Scrooge, very well said. However, I never mentioned the lake you have referred to...Bald Mtn. Lake for the reason I have spoke of previously. In my defense, that's why it was left out of the story.  Every little spot doesn't need to be in print, even on web sites like mine. There is more to the specific lake you have mentioned and if you'd like, contact me by personal email for way route and a long history of my other travels there. The lake I did mention was East Boardman Lake which is full of tiny Eastern Brook Trout and the story was written well before any trail existed.  Further, I never mentioned the foot by foot excerpt of how to get there these days. Now, if you really want the skinny, you know where I am at. Sorry if I some of my treks are not too specific, but then I don't someone like Pappy yelling at me for disclosing his secret place either...

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in the granite high-wild alpine land . . .
www.alpinequest.com
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