[Snowshoe Hare]

Uh-oh, 2-way radios?

[Karen]

Uh, what's the scoop on 2-way radios?? I'm not much into gear, have never used such. Are they a no-no? I honestly don't know because I don't use them and don't know anyone that has. Educate me. Karen

[Quark]

he's just funnin about another thread. 2 way radios are ok if you want to use them.

[Snowshoe Hare]

[Slugman]

They have a lesser utility on solo hikes.

[Snowshoe Hare]

That's funny, I was just going to say you gotta have two to tango.

[jenjen]

Only thing I can add to everyone else's lists would be that garbage bags do work for bivying. Not comfy, but surviveable. To set up an emergency bivy - find a spot as sheltered as possible from rain and wind. Put on your extra layers. Crawl into the garbage bag as far as possible. Wrap the emergency or space blanket around your head and shoulders. Settle in as comfortably as you can. If you need more warmth or something cheery, start a small fire (couple sticks burning in a scooped out hole, NOT a bonfire involving half a small tree) and position yourself to get as much reflected warmth from it as possible. The emergency food I carry is power or energy bars. I'm only gonna eat them if I really have to. Also remember, nobody has ever starved after just one night without food. If you have shelter and water you can survive for awhile.

[Malachai Constant]

There are a lot of good bivy spots along that route. All the way to Colechuck you are in the woods with shelter and los of dry wood. At the lake there will be several parties camped and good camp sites. Going up Assgard there is a strip of trees 1/3 of the way up and sheltered camps at the top. The upper basin would not be a great place to be but there are few hazards theres the trees at the end are another spot. the lower lakes have many good spots and several parties will be there all the time. The most hazardous spot is the descent to Snow Lake again great spots at both lakes and emergency bivy's under overhangs could be used. In an emergency you could build fires. ada has sheletered spots and comfortable camps near the Snow Creek Wall. The area is not remote and lots of folks will be around. In the worst event you could wrap up every one in a trap and easily survive the night. I agree you should bag it if the wether is dicey.

[oosik]

I think since the location is the Enchantments that even for emergencies fires should not be considered an option should something go wrong. If someone wanting to do this sort of trip needs a backup plan, they should just bring what they need for backup. It doesn't seem like a good plan to count on causing an impact on the terrain just because you chose to travel light. Besides, a bivy sack will be warmer than a fire anyway unless you are sitting right on top of it. Light bivy sacks are only 1 to 1 1/2 lbs. Another option is a radiant reflective emergency sack like that marketed by Adventure Medical Kits and possibly others. Space blankets can work, but if you want something better, they probably still make a tube version out of the mylar. I've bivvied with a mylar rectangular space blanket before and they come untucked and tear through the night, so it doesn't do as much for you as you might think it would. The greatest tool to avoid having to bivy? A headlamp that will not go dark on you. As long as you keep moving, no matter how slow, you will be warmer than if you stop for the night. Enough energy bars or snacks should keep the "bonk" away as well as adequate hydration. I'd say no to radios and cellphones, they are useless weight that won't do anything for you. Why no radios? You probably should't have the group split up enough to have need to use them. If they did split up, have them operate in two independant groups for better efficiency. Why no cell phone? The only reason is to call out is because you are late. If you are late, even if you have to stay overnight, you would be out by noon the next day. If you pulled out the cell phone, nobody is going to come for you overnight anyway, likely by the time anyone could find you you would have hiked out under your own power. Just set the expectations of whoever is expecting you to not get worried until after some mid-day time the following day. Probably the only thing to really enhance a light day pack set worth of clothes would be sufficient footcare stuff in case of blisters or sore feet. If the group was functioning as a group, first aid supplies could be pooled and pared down to keep from over duplication.

[Malachai Constant]

Dude, you might wat to chill a bit. Fires are legal half way up to Colchuck. I did not advocate them elsewhere. I think they are legal at Snow and Nada too. A lighter #0.5 oz beat a bivy sac @24 oz. What I am sayin is it's not the Muir snow field. In Sept you can probably spend the night in your civies if you are with a close friend.

[jenjen]

Karen asked a question earlier in this thread about how one would set up an emergency bivy. I just gave her my answer. For myself, things would have to be way worse than just getting benighted for me to build a fire. But that's me. Everybody has a different comfort level when they head out on a trail, knowing how to set up a shelter for the night is part of that comfort level. Besides, there's no better way to get a ranger's attention in the Enchantments than to light a fire of any kind. I can think of a few emergency situations where getting any kind of attention as quickly as possible would be really important.

[Dayhike Mike]

My dad and I have been doing this for years. You should take what we took: Snickers (snack size) Mars bars (now called Snickers Almond, also snack size) Skittles (in the snack size packets, only avail. at Easter and Halloween) Baby Ruth (snack size) Pepperoni (Hormel, in the stick form) Cheese (Tillamook, sharp) Roast Beef Sandwiches 2 water bottles (scoop fresh water from the lakes and streams) 20-year old day pack that's falling apart and has to be sewn back together after every trip Flashlight w/ 2 very weak batteries Camera Lighter First aid kit Clothing-wise, we went pretty simple too: Socks (cotton) Underwear (cotton) Shorts (cotton) T-shirt (yup, still cotton) Polar fleece *or* rain jacket. Ratty, old 8 year old Vasque boots If weather turns bad, you turn around and backtrack or keep on going (depending on whether you've made it halfway yet). If it gets dark you keep on walking, stopping to let the dim light of the flashlight rest and the batteries recover every once in a while. ---- These days I have a decent pack, bring a filter, have swapped out all the cotton for poly-pro and nylon, and have added a pair of trekking poles to the mix. A headlamp also makes a much better companion than the flashlight ever was. I also like brining a cell phone along so I can touch base with home base and let my mom know we're doing well and how nice the weather is on top -- she rests a lot easier and is a lot more likely to let my dad out of the house again, when I make a simple 30 second phone call at least once a trip. Oosik's right though...just keep walking. And be aware of the changing weather...if things are looking bad, turn around and head back out *before* nasty weather hits...keep in mind you're really exposed up there...

[sarbar]

Hi Karen! This is what I brought on my Mother Mt. Loop-and what I'll bring when I do the 'Chants as a dayhike Marmot Diva pack (it has real suspension, and is big enough for me to use as a bivy sack up to my thighs. LLBean softshell-it is 99% waterproof gloves hat long sleeve shirt if wearing shorts, my lightest weight pants extra pair of socks/liners headlmap w/ extra batteries water filter 2L bladder 20 oz coke bottle (because I like to drink Crystal Light mixes, and it is a backup for my bladder) My duct tape is around this. TP & snack ziploc bags for garbage Garbage bags (ziplocs, 2 gallon) maps compass extra shoelace emergency kit of e. blanket & handwarmers (I carry 2) full blown first aid kit (my kit weighs like 14 ounces-it is one of the few areas I do NOT skimp on weight) this includes sunblock and lipbalm sit pad (a FedEx padded mailer) umbrella trekking poles camera whistle fleece or down jacket for stops wallet/laminated permanent ID card I am required to carry due to criminal ID theft of my name (this has my fingerprints on it-this paperwork proves who I am.) My car registration/insurance papers (I don't leave anything with my name in it in my truck) Food: I carry a whole days amount of easy to eat items-my favorite is a Cadbury fruit and nut bar that has 60 grams of fat in it I carry items like bags of peanuts, smoked salmon, bagels with cream cheese, etc... I also carry extra food that I don't touch. A blow by blow flight plan with my man and another person, in writing. He gives me 2 hours over call time. This means I have 2 hours to call him and let him know I am out. I made my call time for Mother Mt. in Wilkenson by 1 minute..lol! I do NOT deviate from my plans if I can help it. Karen...as a joke Marzsit and me said this morning in camp: we need to do the Mother Mt. Loop every month in on season It is dang gorgeous!! If you need another body let me know Now off to plan for my 'Chant run

[#19]

If the weather was decent, I'd carry less than on more remote hikes. I don't think you'd ever be that far from others. At that time of year, help would never be that far away. That may sound like a leach, but most likely, nothing will go wrong. If someone runs out of Snickers or gets a little chilly - oh well. If someone trips and breaks their leg, there will be folks around to help.