[Blue Dome]

I remember as a little kid one year it must have snowed 12+ inches in Bellevue. We had two-foot drifts and school was closed for a week. It was great. No more. And say goodbye to the polar bears (not any Bellevue polar bears). http://www.cnn.com/2005/TECH/science/09/28/arctic.melting.reut/index.html

[Tom]

Note to all. If this topic devolves into non-hiking related political discussion (as it has in the past) it will be locked.

[Scrooge]

An ice free Artic summer and a shrinking ice-shelf in the Antarctic are somehow far away and impersonal; but we don't have to go nearly so far to find the effects of global warming. We've talked about them a lot on this forum, as we hike up in the mountains and find that the glaciers are going, going, gone. This year, I've been struck by three that are still just barely hanging on. The remnants of the Pinnacle Glacier on the north side of Pinnacle Peak were so pitiful when I was there in the middle of July that I thought it unlikely to last the summer. Out at the Ice Caves a few weeks ago, the remaining pile of ice looked unlikely to survive another two years like this last one. And, up in the Enchantments in August, it didn't look like the remains of the Snow Creek Glacier would be around much longer. Dicey's moats are chopping up a section of the Sholes Glacier that was still a pleasant snowfield at this time of year, two years ago. And last year, down at Mt Hood, plans for a romp on the Elliot Glacier were thwarted because the area of open ice appeared to have retreated at least a quarter mile in just a year, leaving an uninviting morass of morrainal rubble. It's true that glaciers like the Colchuck and the Emmons will last our lifetimes, but we're losing a lot, and the character of our mountains is changing sadly in the process. David

[Malachai Constant]

my avatar is peasoup lake which in the 1980's was the color of peasoup for the crescent shaped edge that was not covered by the Lynch Glacier on Daniels, and dotted with icebergs. The Hinman glacier had a lower lobe which is now a shallow lake.

[Tom]

[touron]

I'm sure the "experts" will be guessing and second guessing eachother for the next few decades and perhaps longer. In the meantime we get to witness this interesting phenomena. It's sad to see the glaciers melt away, and I hope it's not a long term trend, but I suppose things could just as easily freeze up, the glaciers expand, and all the lakes we go to disappear until we see books with titles like "1 Hike in Glacier Peak Wilderness" and "3 Hikes in the Alpine Lakes Wilderness." These 4 hikes would be massivley popular and one would have to go hiking in the mall to find solitude.

[Scrooge]

[touron]

I sold my snow shoes to some sucker who doesn't realize global warming is happening. I used the profits to buy the latest model sand crampons.

[Malachai Constant]

The noise level is at least an order of magnitude higher than the general trend. The glaciers are the best indicator of the trend they take many years to melt. Ski seasons are an indicator of the noise. It may even be possible that there may be more good seasons due to increased precipitation and severity of storms. We are in the midst of a big experiment the results we can not determine. Even if all the glaciers melt and we are left with nothing but piles of choss we still cannot determine for sure the cause. Who knows perhaps if it were not for the CO2 and CH4 we would be seeing a renewed ice age.

[Blue Dome]

[Jeepasaurusrex]

Gotta love the natural warming trends the earth goes thru every 1000 years or so. Core samples of glaciers have proven the earth warms and cools in cycles. This has been going on since before man inhabited the earth.

[Blue Dome]

[polarbear]

[MtnGoat]

Some of us must have missed when what the earth does on it's own with respect to warming and cooling became known and proven... so that we can now tell what is "abnormal" compared to what is known and proven "normal". Commence armwaving about making comparisons to the unknowable, deciding this is abnormal compared to what you don't know the reason for in the first place.... and pronouncing this a fact based, non political position. No politics here, just an observation of the facts concerning the stated position. Non political, fact based response #1 i am interested in is who knows the 'normal' temp we "should" be at now, and the proof that they know this.

[Malachai Constant]

THe bottom line is that if we reduce CO2 and CH4 emissions the earths climate will be cooler than if we do not, that we know for sure. It is unknowable as to the absolute cause of this centurys warming but it is most likely increased emissions but, that fact is irrelevant.