[greg]

Some Anasazi stuff.

Cedar Mesa, Utah.

Potsherds, corn cobs, Grand Gulch

Cedar Mesa, Utah

For grinding corn, at Perfect Kiva ruin in Grand Gulch, Utah.

[ree]

OOoooh!!! Cool pictures!! What part of Utah is Cedar Mesa? All of this is bringing back a flood of memories!! -One of which was positively the most embarrassing moment of my entire life! Funny story, but don't want to hijack further.

[greg]

It's in a BLM primitive area near Blanding, very SE Utah, called Grand Gulch, a series of canyons that flows into the San Juan River. That ruin is called Perfect Kiva.

[l]

Saw an excellent show on Chaco a couple years ago. It was narrated by R. Redford and described - in detail - how the geometry of the dwellings and 'streets' was aligned with lunar and solar phenomena. Fascinating and very informative.

[greg]

[ree]

A long time ago, I had a friend come visit from Italy, who wanted to see the southwest. Since I had spent a lot of time there, particularly in Santa Fe, NM, I wanted to make it special. I booked a little casita for us stay on the uber-chic Canyon Rd, and a small plane flight from Santa Fe to Monument Valley for a sightseeing trek by jeep. The morning of the flight, I drank coffee... too much coffee. The other couple who were to go with us bailed, so the pilot put us in a smaller plane, a Cessna 172 (four seater.) I sat in the back, and Giancarlo and the pilot sat in front. I was looking at the map as we flew over Bandelier and other Anasazi settlements over the San Juan River basin, and pointed out all the ruins on the way. I remember impressing the pilot with my knowledge of all these ancient settlements. But it wasn’t long before my bladder was getting uncomfortable with all the jostling around in the plane. Using American idioms to conceal my discomfort to Giancarlo, I asked the pilot, “Are there any gas stations nearby?” Meaning, I needed to use the bathroom. The pilot said we were about an hour away from landing... I was dejected. At this point, I silently started to talk myself out of my bodily needs - trying to convince myself I didn’t have to go to the bathroom - until I eyed the airsickness bag in front of me. It was a bad day to wear a button fly pair of jeans, but undeterred, I took that airsickness bag then tried tactfully to stuff it in my crotch without taking my pants down. The plane was bouncing quite a bit by this time. With their peripheral vision, the pilot and Giancarlo could tell something was going on in back. (Giancarlo told me later he thought I was masturbating!) Finally, I figured I had the bag somewhat positioned correctly. I kept vascillating whether or not I really wanted/had to do this. It was agonizing. Then I just let myself go. The bag filled up some, but to my horror, I could feel wet warmth saturate the back of my legs, pants, and the seat of the plane. I was in a state of utter shame and embarrassment. I pulled the bag out of my pants, twisted it closed and sat in complete shock, until I noticed I was feeling really queasy. All that focus at close distance + the bouncing of the plane was really a bad idea. I opened the windows of the plane, and stared at the horizon for a long time, and uselessly tried talking myself out of my discomfort. Then the pilot dropped the plane fast and steep for our landing. When he went down like that, everything inside me heaved up. I grabbed the remaining airsickness bag and threw up. Both the guys where concerned for me, only adding to my shame. We landed at some dirt strip in the middle of nowhere. The pilot sheepishly told me where to find the trashcan, (ie: get rid of the bag(s)) They saw me throw up, but I wondered if they knew I used two airsickness bags...? I tied a sweatshirt around my waist to hide my wet pants. I felt completely humiliated and embarrassed. We stopped at a trading post where I bought a bunch of dramamine. I ate that instead of my lunch. We had a nice drive through the canyons and mittens of Monument Valley for a bit. When we went back to the plane, I prayed that some pungent gust of urine wouldn’t overwhelm us when the pilot opened up the hot, baking plane. I was so glad I didn’t gulp down my usual array of vitamins that morning! After a couple of minutes in the air, I got knocked out by the dramamine, effectively missing the entire flight back to Santa Fe. I’ll never forget that trip (except for the part that I was passed out). I remember everything about it, with horrifying clarity. Humiliation makes memories sharper, perhaps.

[greg]

Man, you tell a pretty damn good story Ree. Maybe you were feeling a little poorly over this site in Canyonlands NP:

This panel is called the Harvest Scene because of pictographs apparently showing women harvesting something. To me its all about shamans and magic. I believe the Basketmaker culture left these several thousand years ago.

This is the cliff that bears the Harvest Scene pictographs, Canyonlands NP.

[ree]

[Stones]

Ree, those are amazing stories about your experiences with the Hopi and Navajo. The plane ride, that's hilarious great story! I visited Cahokia back in 1989 while working on a project in Saint Louis for a few weeks. Cahokia, Saint Louis Blues at the old arena, and PTs in East Saint Louis made for a memorable trip.

[polarbear]

[greg]

The Burke Museum web site has some interesting stuff on Kennewick Man and migrations: "Several recent discoveries have created new ideas about the arrival of people to the Americas. One of the most important is an archaeological site in Chile — Monte Verde — which is at least 12,500 years old; another part of the site might be 33,000 years old. Because of its location 10,000 miles south of Alaska and the Bering Strait, Monte Verde means that people may have arrived in the Americas much earlier than 12,500 years ago. Such discoveries have sparked discussions about the possibility that people traveled from Asia to North America along the coast, perhaps using boats. New genetic research suggests that Native Americans share a common ancestor with the native peoples who now occupy south-central Asia. Some anthropologists have noted that the narrow, elongated skull shape of Kennewick Man — and other features traditionally called "Caucasoid" — are shared by several early populations in Asia and the Pacific. Based on this information, many scholars believe that it would be "far-fetched" at this point to suggest that Kennewick Man came from Europe." http://www.washington.edu/burkemuseum/kman/ancientpeoples.htm

[salish]

Greg - fascinating article. My own tribe (Montana Salish) were said to have broken off from the interior Salish 1500-2000 years ago, and traveled through interior B.C. and ultimately to the Bitterroot Valley of Montana, which our tribe considers it's ancestral homeland. The time frame was based on the current science at that time. Still, some of the old timers claimed the people were there before then. I think we're all in agreement that we're seeing more and more evidence of people having migrated long before anthros’ originally thought. But then I know some native people who say they were always here. Who's to argue? By the way, great photos of the artifacts from south Utah! Shacknasty - I saw that Redford narration on Chaco, too. He did a good job and I learned a lot more than I previously knew about Chaco. I'd like to see that again. Ree - I'm almost too flabbergasted to respond to your airplane pee story. It is absolutely wonderful, and should be in the running for best post of the year. I took an airplane flight into the Grand Canyon as a child and puked all over the inside of the plane, but I didn't have to pee. I also have a good "gotta pee story" of a hunting trip I took many years ago in Pateros, but it all pales in comparison to your story. Moral of your story may be that pilots need to stock this: http://www.rei.com/product/726.htm?vcat=REI_ALL_CATEGORIES Cliff

[greg]

Thank you Cliff, I was wondering about your perspective. I guess the bottom line is that while the Egyptians were building the pyramids, give or take, the Maya were building temples in the high Andes. Who am I to say?

[ree]

Thanks for your kind words, folks. Yes, that funnel would have saved me hours of suffering and humilitaion!!- and I would have seen a lot more than the inside of an airsickness bag! So Cliff, where do you stand (coming from a native perspective) about Kennewick man? Should he be studied, or put in the ground by native americans without study? How do you feel about non-natives owning/collecting ancient native antiquities? Are the Montana Salish known for any particular artistic discipline? (Eg: Zuni: pottery, Hopi: Kachinas, Navajo: weaving and sandpainting, etc.) Some of this is topical because now you have the Greek government wanting the Elgin Marbles back from the British Museum in London. The Egyptian government wants its antiquities back as well. Greg, you got me curious about timelines, so I went digging in my old books. I have "Anasazi Pottery", originally published in 1969, which catalogs the Earl Morris Collection of southwest pottery. I also have "Generations in Clay: Pueblo Pottery of the American Southwest." I bought the books ages ago when I got interested in collecting southwest antiquities. Here's a timeline of southwest pottery makers.

graph

And a map of the region where the collections were found.

map1

Here's a drawing of some special Anasazi pottery I did.

pottery1

That Kennewick man almost appears primitive to the point of appearing almost "caveman' seems expected. The old kingdom of Egypt was around 2500 BC... long after Kennewick man walked the earth. (I mistakenly thought the old kingdom was much earlier.) Still it's interesting to compare what was happening with the Basketmakers of the southwest to what was happening in the Hellenistic period of Greece... which predates the basketmakers by 500 years, give or take. Great topic...!

[ree]

Since we're talking about ancient sites and civilizations, I'm wondering how many here have been to Big Horn Medicine Wheel in Wyoming? I went there ages ago, and it is very special... especially seeing all the prayer offerings there. It was magnificent, quiet, and sacred.