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Snowkeeper
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Snowkeeper
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 12:29 am 
I grew up hiking the local trails, and never really seemed to think I needed to learn to use a compass. However, now that I am living in Alaska and hiking so much unfamiliar territory, I am finding my nose in the many "How to use a compass" books. In May, I am hoping to be enrolled in some orienteering classes here locally, and maybe even have some fun doing it!!LOL.. My question to you is: How many of you are knowledgeable with a compass and map? And how often do you use it? Do you actually even carry one? How long before you decided it was time to learn to use one? And why? etc... Oh, and what kind of compass do you carry or recommend? Thats a few questions.. but knowing this bunch, its not too many wink.gif ... Thanks! smile.gif OOOOOPPSSS.. Maybe this topic would have been better suited for Gear Talk....sorry. frown.gif

Proverbs 3:5
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MCaver
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 12:32 am 
I learned to use a map and compass in college, being a geography major. I brushed up on my skills when I moved to the Pacific Northwest 2.5 years ago. I always take a compass with me on a hike, and I don't think I've ever needed to use it. I have used it to identify a specific peak by name for photos, though. smile.gif

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Dayhike Mike
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 12:52 am 
I always have a compass with me, but with topographic maps and a good view of the surroundings I haven't ever really needed to use it. That need has decreased even further with the recent addition of a GPS unit to the ol' bag of tricks. Yep, it's getting harder and harder to get lost with all these newfangled gadgets and toys.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke "Ignorance is natural. Stupidity takes commitment." -Solomon Short
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Magellan
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 1:21 am 
I use a compass very frequently and find it indespencible. As long as it's reasonably accurate (you can read every 2 degrees) it doesn't matter what kind it is. But you have to know how to deal with declination. If you don't, a compass can really mess you up. A mirror is handy for checking sunscreen blobs on your fase. If you know how to use it for cighting, it increaces accurasy. But not a vital feature. If you point the red needle to magnetic north (~20 deg for North Cascades) then a compass with adjustable declination is unnessecary. Although the adjustable thingie is a skosh more accurate. GPS seems a little gadgeterian. However a Search and Rescue buddy thinks every party should have one. Seems like a lot of fuss cetting all the coordinates and being a computer geek out in the woods. A compass is quicker (but only if you can cight landmarks). If you stick to trails, you may not use a compass very often. Last time I bought a compass, the simple compass with turnable bezel was 1/6 the cost of the mirror/declination/avalanche slope/magnifying glass/bottle opener/windshield scraper/do-everything compass. So I bought the simple one. Works fine but I miss looking at my sunscreen makeup. Another extremely useful devise is an altimeter. It must be recet frequently due to weather changes, but is another indispencible tool. And in many locales, probably more convenient to use if you stick to trails.

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Magellan
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 1:27 am 
Addendum to previous post: This message is brought to you by the letters "c" and "s". Both of which are in the word "compass". Beginning with a "c" and ending with 2 "s"'s, it's the perfect word for figuring out how to act responcible with your spelling.

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Tom
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 1:49 am 
Here's a beginner tutorial with a high signal to noise ratio: http://www.learn-orienteering.org/old/

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#19
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 9:42 am 
Guy and I stopped on a very fogbound ridge, miles from a trail, to eat something. When we finished and started to leave I wanted to go the opposite direction as my friend. Our discussion turned to rant.gif ing. Finally, I pulled out my compass and proved my friend was right. suuure.gif The ability to AT LEAST orientate North and South is indispensable. Please carry a compass.

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MCaver
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 10:03 am 
I have a horrible sense of direction. I swear I could get turned around in my own apartment. If it wasn't for the sun as even a vague idea what direction I'm facing, I'd be completely turned around most of the time. Thus I always carry a compass. I haven't really had to use it for navigation because I'm usually on a well-established trail that's pretty easy to folllow. Maps are extremely useful even on trails for me because I have a very poor sense of distance as well. waah.gif I can estimate distance by using natural landmarks on the map -- stream crossings, etc. Thus, I've been reluctant to bushwhack so far. huh.gif

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El Puma
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 11:31 am 
X-C navigation seems to be something that was emphasized in the Swiss schools where I grew up. In about 7th grade we were all issued compi and maps (I still think Swiss topos are among the best in the world) and given, over the course of 3 months or so, assignments of varying difficulties. This was part of National Geography, a standard class an hour long three times a week. There were tests on map production (cylindrical vs. conical projections etc) and we even built a small relief model of a local valley from cardboard cutouts of isogonic lines. Also tests on symbology etc. The culmination was a half-day orienteering-game (even though we didn't know it as a national sport back then). Various locations worth different point values; you had to collect the max amount of points in a given period of time. Usually it was far easier getting to many small-value locations than the elusive 50-pointer. Many of the points were not accessible from another so you had to plan your route rather carefully. My friends and I were lucky as the final took place in the woods we roamed frequently anyway, so we had a distinct advantage of local knowledge and aced it. I find it easier to navigate with a good map and terrain features than by compass, though I did find extensive use for that skill during a summer in the ANWR; creeks and rivers are mostly south to north and there are limited features inbetween. I use my old trusty retractable Silva Swiss-Army compass, with extendable mirror and cord for plotting. It is part of my standard hiking package, anytime I go. Mostly I believe a compass will give you a great reference to go by, but it requires diligence and practice to develop real accuracy (+/- 1 degree). And for the most part it's relatively unneccesary, anyway. I can see the value thereof when you're descending from Camp Muir to Paradise in the fog, for example. But even there you have terrain boundaries to stay within (ridges, outcroppings, dropoffs etc). Within limits, any compass will do you well as the accuracy is only as good as the end-user. I enjoy the practice.

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Jonathan
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 3:25 pm 
I carry one but find using an Altimeter and Map in concert a better way to locate "where I am". A compass only tells you one thing Magnetic North; if you don't know where you are on a map how can you know which way you want to go. (Altimeter and Map will not help much in the desert or frozen tundra but in the Cascades,, I wouldn't be caught without them.) Now once I have determined "where I am" I have used a compass to get a baring to where I am going, and have found it helpful to pick out peaks. I also use known elevations along trails as jump off points into the trailess woods, and often locate the spot I took off from days later on my way back. They can also give you a good estimate of progress up the side of a mountain; I'm half way to the top. Jonathan

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Snowkeeper
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Snowkeeper
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 5:05 pm 
Altimeter Advice
Well, with all this talk about altimeters...Can you tell me what is the better to buy? I havent a clue! And a small budget. Thanks!

Proverbs 3:5
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salish
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PostSun Mar 30, 2003 5:21 pm 
This is a really good thread, and I'm learning a lot. I learned how to use a map & compass as a Boy Scout, but over the years I have to admit that my skills have really gone downhill. Using the trail systems here in the Cascades I've just never needed to use a compass very often. And I actually do have a pretty good sense of direction - so far. As El Puma mentioned, I did get caught in a huge cloud bank coming off Camp Muir in 1975, on a day hike, and that was scary. Luckily, we hooked up with some mountaineers who we followed down. By the way, El Puma, that's a very interesting story about your Swiss schools curriculum. Jonathan - you know I exhausted this altimeter issue many months ago on the TB loop, but I still haven't made my mind up on which altimeter to buy. Since I'm an old fashioned guy and luddite to boot I really like the old mechanical Swiss Thommen altimeters, but the one you talked about was pretty neat, too. So was the Sherpa. I'll be buying one before I hit the trails this season.

My short-term memory is not as sharp as it used to be. Also, my short-term memory's not as sharp as it used to be.
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Newt
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PostMon Mar 31, 2003 5:50 am 
I carry both compass and map of the area I'm in. Being that I usually stay on trail it only gets used to help identify distant features. I learned to use it sometime back when I was a kid. NN

It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
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Ice Girl
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PostMon Mar 31, 2003 9:22 am 
i always carry a compass and a map of the area i am hiking in. Plus a larger map for identifying mountain tops in the distants. Which is really fun to try to identify. Then you get to see them from different angles and views. i do believe i could use a compass if i had to, but never have had to. i do go off trail a little bit. Only once lost my way, but we got out of it. Ice Girl

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Bungee Boy
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PostMon Mar 31, 2003 2:40 pm 
I use my maps and compass on a regular basis. If you stick to the lowland hikes, limit yourself to metled out trails, and blue sky days, then you probably won't need to use them much and you'll have a short season. I'm, on the other hand a 4 season adventurer and from the volcanoes to the alpine peaks of the cascades have found the ability of map and compass navigation essential to getting to your destination as well as back to the trailhead in the off trail, cross-country, snow covered, and fogged in terrain of the Cascades. Granted I don't need to use them on every outing, but this winter I've gotten lots of practice and had lots of fun. It's amazing what you can do, where you can go, when traveling on bearings breaking your own trail. Knowledge of map and compass should be essential to back country travel. But then again it's your life so it's your choice.

Ever Upwards
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