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Ski
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 8:43 am 
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From that article, it sounds like Minnesota did (or does) have a management plan, but it sounds like a lawsuit threw that out the window.

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RandyHiker
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 8:48 am 
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Sky Hiker wrote:
https://www.mprnews.org/story/2015/04/27/endangered-wolf-control

So in your thinking delisting them would lead to their extermination? Why would that be the case, when state has come up with a wolf plan? I am all ears.

SkyHiker, your article is from 2015, mine is from 2018.  So the "out of control" data is out of date.
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 11:27 am 
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Surely the population has only increased since it is illegal to kill a wolf there unless it is threat to a person.
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 11:42 am 
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Sky Hiker wrote:
Surely the population has only increased since it is illegal to kill a wolf there unless it is threat to a person.

Apparently you didn't bother to read the 1st line of the article I linked.

Quote:
Population estimate statistically unchanged from last year
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 11:46 am 
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So you actually believe that with no higher predators, hunting season, etc .  That the population remains unchanged when in every other state it has only increased? That's like saying wa population remains the same, yes maybe Confirmed packs but the population can only increase
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RandyHiker
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 12:03 pm 
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Sky Hiker wrote:
So you actually believe that with no higher predators, hunting season, etc .  That the population remains unchanged when in every other state it has only increased? That's like saying wa population remains the same, yes maybe Confirmed packs but the population can only increase

You have a hypothesis about the wolf population growing "out of control" and when the data doesn't follow that hypothesis,  you are doubling down rather that wondering "what is really happening".

What would the scientific method ask you to do at this point?
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 12:24 pm 
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So you believe the population has not changed? In some area yes I believe it is out of control. In all the areas where they exist, no.
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RandyHiker
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 12:50 pm 
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Sky Hiker wrote:
So you believe the population has not changed? In some area yes I believe it is out of control. In all the areas where they exist, no.

It's not about what I believe -- it's what the biologists at the Minnesota and Michigan DNR are reporting.

Do you have any data showing areas where the wolf population is growing "out of control", if for please show the data and it's source.
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 1:07 pm 
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Let me ask you this. When wolves come on people's decks,  yards, property's and kill the land owners animals are they under control?
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RandyHiker
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 1:16 pm 
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Sky Hiker wrote:
Let me ask you this. When wolves come on people's decks,  yards, property's and kill the land owners animals are they under control?

It seems you don't have any data to support your opinion -- otherwise you would cite it -- so now you are trying to deflect.

People having repeated issues with wolves attacking their stock can be authorized to kill wolves

https://www.agweb.com/article/oregon-rancher-can-kill-2-wolves-following-attack-on-cow-herd/
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 1:19 pm 
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I posted the NPR news story stating this was occurring. I you chose to think it is a bogus report then so be it.
Not all states where wolves killpeoples animals are they allowed to kill them.
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 1:26 pm 
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Sky Hiker wrote:
I posted the NPR news story stating this was occurring. I you chose to think it is a bogus report then so be it.
Not all states where wolves killpeoples animals are they allowed to kill them.

Again you posted an article from 2015 that speculated that wolf populations would continue to grow -- but I posted an article from 2018 that showed that in fact the wolf population had not continued to grow at the feared rate and had in fact stabilized.

Each state does have it own rules and procedures for dealing with livestock losses -- just as each state has their own rules and procedures for deer hunting.

Have you personally lost any livestock or pets to wolf attacks ?
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 3:42 pm 
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So the article you publish stated that the population was stable. Is it possible that it was already out of control? When the federal guidelines for the population was between 1251 to 1400. When the population is estimated at 2356 to 3386 with a +/- factor of 500.

Now I ask why you would ask a question about me losing an animal or having a conflict with a wolf?
Yes deer populations are managed differently from state to state but they are classified as game animals.
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treeswarper
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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 3:49 pm 
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2017 Minnesota wolf population increases 25%.
https://www.twincities.com/2017/09/25/minnesota-wolf-population-appears-to-rise-25-percent/

2018 Cheesehead wolf population decreases by 2%
https://www.wpr.org/dnr-data-suggests-wolf-population-could-be-stabilizing

2018 Yooper wolf population stabilizing and growing slowly
http://rivergrandrapids.com/wolf-population-is-growing-in-michigans-upper-peninsula/

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PostMon Nov 26, 2018 4:03 pm 
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Sky hiker don't get baited by them as data and articles can be manipulated to satisfy their side. It's not worth your time or effort.
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