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touron
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Joined: 15 Sep 2003
Posts: 10293 | TRs | Pics
Location: Plymouth Rock |
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touron
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 Sun Dec 07, 2003 8:58 pm |
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Do I hear $85? Going....going...going...sold, to the highest bidder!
Touron is a nougat of Arabic origin made with almonds and honey or sugar, without which it would just not be Christmas in Spain.
Touron is a nougat of Arabic origin made with almonds and honey or sugar, without which it would just not be Christmas in Spain.
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Slugman
It’s a Slugfest!
Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 16874 | TRs | Pics
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Slugman
It’s a Slugfest!
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Sun Dec 07, 2003 9:06 pm |
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catwoman
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Joined: 16 Dec 2001
Posts: 888 | TRs | Pics
Location: somewhere near Tacoma |
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catwoman
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Sun Dec 07, 2003 10:33 pm |
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 Yep. I know I'm confused. Even more than before!
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Slugman
It’s a Slugfest!
Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 16874 | TRs | Pics
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Slugman
It’s a Slugfest!
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Sun Dec 07, 2003 10:50 pm |
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I can't argue with that!  
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Quark
Niece of Alvy Moore
Joined: 15 May 2003
Posts: 14152 | TRs | Pics
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Quark
Niece of Alvy Moore
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Sun Dec 07, 2003 11:09 pm |
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| sarbar wrote: | | Quit growsing and take it like an adult. |
Sound familiar? "Just lay back and enjoy it."
Slug has a right to grouse. Acceptance is what is leading to an overtaxed, controlled, panoptic society that is very un-American. (Like the NYT reported who asked a tourist if he minded the surveillance cameras in the Statue of Liberty. He said "No," and then something like, "if I'm not doing anything wrong, why should surveillance bother me?" Yet another one who lays back to enjoy being raped).
We need Civil Disobedience back in our lives. Things are getting too boring in this country.
I feel bad for folks like the parents of the Lykkens who are intimidated (and understandably so) out of hiking, and folks from out of the country who are confused by the system, and get ticketed. "Welcome to America, here's your ticket." It's embarrassing.
You go, Slug!
"...Other than that, the post was more or less accurate."
Bernardo, NW Hikers' Bureau Chief of Reporting
"...Other than that, the post was more or less accurate."
Bernardo, NW Hikers' Bureau Chief of Reporting
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jenjen
Moderatrix
Joined: 30 Jun 2003
Posts: 7617 | TRs | Pics
Location: Sierra stylin |
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jenjen
Moderatrix
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Sun Dec 07, 2003 11:20 pm |
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Has anyone else noticed an odd proliferation of boulders popping up on the sides of dirt roads just a little over 1/4 mile from the trailheads?
Not that I think they're being placed there or anything.
If life gives you melons - you might be dyslexic
If life gives you melons - you might be dyslexic
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polarbear
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Joined: 16 Dec 2001
Posts: 3680 | TRs | Pics
Location: Snow Lake hide-away |
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Slugman
It’s a Slugfest!
Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 16874 | TRs | Pics
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Slugman
It’s a Slugfest!
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Mon Dec 08, 2003 12:58 am |
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I totally agree. Things that have a general public benefit should be financed by general taxation.
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Malachai Constant
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Joined: 13 Jan 2002
Posts: 16092 | TRs | Pics
Location: Back Again Like A Bad Penny |
Saying people approve of the fees when they are under fear of fines and/or expensive trials in remote courts is an awful lot like John Dillenger saying folks approve of bank robbery because they keep giving him cash when he asks with a winning smile and a gun.
"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
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Stefan
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Joined: 17 Dec 2001
Posts: 5091 | TRs | Pics
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Stefan
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Mon Dec 08, 2003 10:20 am |
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| polarbear wrote: | | Things that we should not have to buy permits for:
1. Walking through a city park
2. Having a picnic in a state park
3. Hiking to Snow Lake |
Let me add: Checking out a book at a library.
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Stefan
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Joined: 17 Dec 2001
Posts: 5091 | TRs | Pics
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Stefan
Member
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Mon Dec 08, 2003 10:22 am |
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| jimmymac wrote: | | When you lump trail head parking and improved (Whinybago) sites into a single fee class, I'd be real surprised if hikers don't end up subsidizing the users of the improved sites -- especially if existing trail head fees don't change much. |
THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT WILL HAPPEN!
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sarbar
Living The Dream
Joined: 28 Jan 2002
Posts: 8055 | TRs | Pics
Location: Freeland, Wa |
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sarbar
Living The Dream
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Mon Dec 08, 2003 11:39 am |
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What you all forget is this:
ALL THESE THINGS ARE PRIVELEGES, NOT RIGHTS.
Privleeges don't have to be free.
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cheakamus
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Joined: 19 Jul 2003
Posts: 331 | TRs | Pics
Location: Seattle |
| sarbar wrote: | | What you all forget is this:
ALL THESE THINGS ARE PRIVELEGES, NOT RIGHTS.
Privleeges don't have to be free. |
Since when is walking in the woods, which, after all, we own, a "privilege"? Is walking on a city street a privilege? How about breathing, drinking water, etc.? To me, these are all equally human "rights," which you acquire simply by being born.
A couple of years ago, the "master plan" being heavily promoted for Washington Park Arboretum featured fencing in the park and charging an admission fee--this was eventually dropped after loud protests from neighbors. I personally no longer visit state parks (except to camp) because of the $5 parking fee. Now, if I want to eat lunch somewhere, I stop at the freeway rest stops.
Paying a fee to use our forests is philosophically obnoxious to me (though I eventually succumbed). The counterargument is usually, "Well, it's only a nominal fee." Try telling that to a familly earning less than $20,000 a year (there are plenty). If even one child is prevented by the fee from using, enjoying, and learning about our forests, then the fee's not worth it, in my opinion.
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sarbar
Living The Dream
Joined: 28 Jan 2002
Posts: 8055 | TRs | Pics
Location: Freeland, Wa |
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sarbar
Living The Dream
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Mon Dec 08, 2003 12:26 pm |
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You can cry and whine all you want but parks and trails and green trees are not rights you are born with. And maybe that is sad-it would be nice if that was a right. But neither is free libraries or places to walk your dogs a given right. They are privileges that do cost money to provide. Your right to life is even't guarnteed! Nor is clean air and water. They might be a right, but they don't come free.
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Stefan
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Joined: 17 Dec 2001
Posts: 5091 | TRs | Pics
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Stefan
Member
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Mon Dec 08, 2003 1:17 pm |
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| sarbar wrote: | | You can cry and whine all you want but parks and trails and green trees are not rights you are born with. And maybe that is sad-it would be nice if that was a right. But neither is free libraries or places to walk your dogs a given right. They are privileges that do cost money to provide. Your right to life is even't guarnteed! Nor is clean air and water. They might be a right, but they don't come free. |
I am sure glad Tom doesn't charge me a fee to flame on this site! Well.....not yet anyway.......
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Notice it was sponsored by seven Republicans! 
Always looking out for us little people! (warning, sarcasm!)
Edit: I just made an adjustment to this thread's title, required by the truth-in-posting laws. 
Let's not forget this demo thing has been extended so many times that I'm sure "demo" will soon become a synonym for "permanent". An attempt is being made to foist a permanent fee on us with little opportunity for public input and Congress thinks we like the fees because more and more people are buying permits??? And you get fined if you don't have a permit. What kind of logic is this? 
