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polarbear
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PostSun Feb 08, 2004 11:20 pm 
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USGS research paper on pepper spray.

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salish
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PostTue Feb 10, 2004 9:11 am 
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PB, I just found this and it is very helpful, thanks.
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jimmymac
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PostTue Feb 10, 2004 10:06 am 
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I didn't realize that there was such a big difference between the concentrations used in bear spray and people spray. Bear spray seems to be too weak to reliably repel terrorists and flagging tape users, but it's got the volume and reach needed for a bear. People spray is much stronger, but may run dry before adequately affecting a bear, unless you're an excellent shot. This poses a multi-purpose/ultra-light challenge.

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Slugman
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PostTue Feb 10, 2004 11:22 am 
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Good link, PB. So, my pepper spray and air horn system is an approved method, over 90% effective even without the airhorn, compared to about 40% effectiveness with a gun. Did you read that, Joe? Out of 110 people killed by bears in Alaska, 44 had guns and it didn't help them. But only two people with pepper spray have been killed, out of 22 total. Of course, there are no stats for deterring psychos.

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Dslayer
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PostTue Feb 10, 2004 3:42 pm 
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How many of the 44 with guns that were killed by bears actually got shots off?  Help me out here and save me from reading the whole article.  If I'm laying in my tent and Mr. Bear savages me and I can't get a shot off -it hardly seems germane to the point.

This is interesting stuff, though, about pepper spray.
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MooseAndSquirrel
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PostTue Feb 10, 2004 4:49 pm 
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Don't laugh- what about some kind of a perimeter zapper wire or something like what's used for keeping dogs in the yard- only on a BIGGER scale with more zapppp for bears/humans and semi-human sasquatches? You can't tell me they won't someday have a little portable unit you could pack in to set up a perimeter defensive zone around your camp? It'll sell like hotcakes. Don't have to kill any thing- just stun the bejeezus outta them. Hell, the military probably is long into R&D on something like that to protect troop camps.

Yeah, yeah, someone will chime in with we already have stun-guns, but you still need to aim and shoot the damn thing at some slobbering, teeth-baring beast ready to pounce on ya.
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jimmymac
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PostTue Feb 10, 2004 6:01 pm 
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Sounds good... Unless it's a cougar pouncing on you from above. Damn.

Maybe BC could come up with an inflatable kevlar dome. With a bug zapper on the inside and a 20,000 candle-power strobe on the outside! Talk about safe!

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salish
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PostTue Feb 10, 2004 7:12 pm 
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Dslayer - that's a good question. I think a lot of maulings come when the people don't expect it, or don't have time to get a revolver or cannister out.

I'm probably going to buy some bear spray this year, as I know I will be hiking in bear country back in Montana this July. I know you had your "close encounter" last summer in Montana, too.  I've decided that the old Model 29 will probably stay home.  The question I have is - how would you draw down and get a decent bone breaking shot into a charging grizzly, with it's head moving up and down and side to side? All this while you are standing your ground scared shitless? I'm thinking the wider arc of bear spray may be the way to go. At least you'd have a better chance of hitting the target (in this case it's muzzle). I'll make up my mind later this year.

Years ago I was charged by a large range bull while bird hunting in the Watson Draw above Pateros. The old bull came trotting at me from a far enough distance that I was able to run to an old abandoned rock shelter and find saftey on the high ground. He was big and there was no doubt I would have been severely injured if he had caught me. I started packing my .41 mag S&W after that, but gave that up after deciding there was no way I could hit a big bull charging at me with his head bobbing up and down like they do.  Wonder if bear spray would work on cattle and cougars? smile.gif

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peppersteak'n'ale
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PostTue Feb 10, 2004 8:19 pm 
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salish wrote:
Wonder if bear spray would work on cattle and cougars?

One can always experiment, please share with us the results when you find out!  tongue.gif
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Malachai Constant
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PostTue Feb 10, 2004 8:28 pm 
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Gear Guysays it would. The problem is that they usually attack from above and behind (poses a problem with pistols too.

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jimmymac
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PostTue Feb 10, 2004 8:29 pm 
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The guys my brother fished with in Alaska all carried slightly modified (illegal) shot guns. As I recall, the theory was to not worry about getting off a good fatal shot, but to first do enough damage to a front leg/shoulder to prevent the bear from reaching you. Then, supposedly you could tidy up with any remaining shells. Their concern was with a large grizzly reaching them with one or more bullets on board or with some through-and-through wounds.

If the pepper spray mist gets into the animal's respiratory path and eyes, I could see how it might have the same result of disabling the bear enough to halt his approach or reorder his priorities.

Having to deal with a small calibre wound, unless it is very well placed, may only rank second place on the bear's to-do list. After he checks off item #1, I guess it really doesn't matter how much trouble the GSW ultimately gives him.

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polarbear
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PostWed Feb 11, 2004 8:16 pm 
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I think if I were in Alaska I would carry both the pepper spray and a gun to be used as a backup.

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Billygoat
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PostFri Jul 02, 2004 1:39 am 
Pepper spray
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Those people with guns must have been darn poor shots. And if somebodys stupid enough to be close enough to a bear to use pepper spray, they shouldnt be out in the woods to begin with.
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bonobo
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PostFri Jul 02, 2004 10:46 am 
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Billygoat wrote:
... And if somebodys stupid enough to be close enough to a bear to use pepper spray, they shouldnt be out in the woods to begin with.


Umm, I've had close up bear encounters twice - you can't always avoid them. Just because one has pepper spray doesn't mean one's out looking to mess with a bear, or made stupid decisions. Sometimes you turn a corner and there they are, or in my case walk back to a barn, and there it is. Oh, I was probably stupid to be that close to the bear then, too - I shouldn't have been at the ranch to begin with, according to your logic.
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Allison
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PostTue Jul 06, 2004 12:46 am 
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I'd like to hear more about encounters with black bears.

Seems like they are not super common.  Anyone have something happen with the ones seen most around here?

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