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Allison Feckless Swooner
Joined: 17 Dec 2001 Posts: 12287 | TRs | Pics Location: putting on my Nikes before the comet comes |
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Allison
Feckless Swooner
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:30 pm
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Some of the talk on this here site has got me thinking:
Maybe backcountry users need more resources for learning good stewardship. I've noticed the same thing in the climbing community, and I'm wondering if people have thoughts on how the concept could be better presented, esp. to new hikers/climbers/outdoorspeople.
Let's hear it.
www.allisonoutside.com
follow me on Twitter! @AllisonLWoods
www.allisonoutside.com
follow me on Twitter! @AllisonLWoods
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mgd Member
Joined: 27 May 2003 Posts: 3143 | TRs | Pics Location: Full Moon Saloon |
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mgd
Member
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 6:50 pm
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The best thing, in my opinion, is to have signs at trailheads showing the work that has been done to protect certain areas. For example, at Snow Lake, have some photos of the re-veg effort and a picture or two of those doing the work. Give some stats on how long it takes plants to grow at high elevation and how short the growing season is.
Areas get trashed because people are ignorant and don't realize how much work goes into keeping something pristine.
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Slugman It’s a Slugfest!
Joined: 27 Mar 2003 Posts: 16874 | TRs | Pics
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Slugman
It’s a Slugfest!
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 6:52 pm
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I agree in that not all things are obvious to beginners. No one needs to be told not to litter. Those that do it already know it's wrong. But things like not reinforcing partially-made micro trails, avoiding the creation of new campsites, REAL "leave no trace" (at ALL) hiking and camping, these things need to be taught, including the fact that banana peels, etc, are not OK to toss on the side of the trail, even if they ARE "bio-degradeable". I remember once in Olympic national park, maybe 1992 or so, I took a shortcut from one trail to another, cut the corner if you will, following a "micro-trail". A ranger saw me and kindly explained why it was so important to follow the main trail to the junction, then turn on the other trail. The alternative is cris-crossing trails everywhere, instead of the few that were necessary. It seemed kind of nit-picky to me at the time, but I follow the rules, so I changed the way I hike to accommodate his informatrion. Now, having been to several hundred other places, I see much better the wisdom of this wilderness ethic. So I guess education must go hand in hand with experience, since most people don't follow rules they disagree with or don't understand.
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Blue Dome Now with Retsyn
Joined: 12 Aug 2004 Posts: 3144 | TRs | Pics Location: Cleaning up the dogma. |
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Blue Dome
Now with Retsyn
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 6:53 pm
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A good fit for REI. Once a year they could sponsor a stewardship campaign and make it coincide with one of their spring sales as follows:
For the typical two-week sale period, include a paper flyer with every receipt of an REI purchase. Implement an online flyer with the receipt of every online purchase.
The flyer would talk about the importance of stewardship, historical aspects, and the value of teaching children such lessons. To keep things fresh, each year the flyer content would be different but emphasize the same themes.
Also, have several subsequent nationwide stewardship events prepared—trail maintenance and habitat recovery for alpine, desert and water-oriented regions such as tree planting, flower and native plant recovery, salmon and other native species recovery, litter clean-up.
When a REI member participated in one of the sanctioned stewardship events, they would bring their flyer and somehow get it validated—signed, stamped, whatever. They could then present it for $20 off their next purchase good through that calendar year. One coupon per member.
Win for free national REI advertising and media coverage, win for customers for coupon and satisfaction/lessons gained from service, win for the environment.
“I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell.”
— Harry S. Truman
“I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell.”
— Harry S. Truman
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Allison Feckless Swooner
Joined: 17 Dec 2001 Posts: 12287 | TRs | Pics Location: putting on my Nikes before the comet comes |
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Allison
Feckless Swooner
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 7:15 pm
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Karen, thanks for the thoughtful response. I hope we see more of this. I may not be in the position myself to change the world, but maybe there are resources out there that I could tap if this conversation really takes off.
I think a lot of how you view land stewardship has to do with how you got started in the outdoors and with whom. Me, I grew up in a household with one foot firmly planted outdoors all the time, so the notion of good stewardship is ingrained in me just like, oh, heck, I don't know, the multiplication tables. I don't think that's a real common occurrence though. I wonder if there is any way to get that concept into little kids' heads? Do they teach it in Scouts, or school?
I like this idea of something with a big outdoor retailer like REI. It's the sort of thing they might be interested in and retailers maybe have more clout with outdoor enthusiasts than say, WTA.
More, more, keep those ideas coming.....
www.allisonoutside.com
follow me on Twitter! @AllisonLWoods
www.allisonoutside.com
follow me on Twitter! @AllisonLWoods
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Backpacker Joe Blind Hiker
Joined: 16 Dec 2001 Posts: 23956 | TRs | Pics Location: Cle Elum |
marylou wrote: | Some of the talk on this here site has got me thinking:
Maybe backcountry users need more resources for learning good stewardship. I've noticed the same thing in the climbing community, and I'm wondering if people have thoughts on how the concept could be better presented, esp. to new hikers/climbers/outdoorspeople.
Let's hear it. |
Yes but in what way are you speaking?
I say hello to everyone I meet on the trail. I offer advice whenever I can. I've offered fuel, rain gear, rafts, and even a tent once while I was on the way out and a group was on the way in.
Help me out here.
TB
"If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide."
— Abraham Lincoln
"If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide."
— Abraham Lincoln
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Allison Feckless Swooner
Joined: 17 Dec 2001 Posts: 12287 | TRs | Pics Location: putting on my Nikes before the comet comes |
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Allison
Feckless Swooner
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 8:26 pm
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We're talking about taking care of the land when we talk stewardship.
In no order, here are some stewardship issues:
LNT, party size, Wilderness, public comment and participation in policy development, redevelopment in the Parks, inholdings, checkerboard stuff, fires, flagging, off-trail hidden gems, TRs, stock, mountain bikes, dirt bikes, snowmobiles, trail maintenance, fees, logging and extractives, bolting, grizzly habitat, erosion.....the list goes on and on, but them's a few of the issues and topics you could stick in the Stewardship basket.
Heck, we could have a whole forum dedicated to Stewardship and backcountry ethics!
www.allisonoutside.com
follow me on Twitter! @AllisonLWoods
www.allisonoutside.com
follow me on Twitter! @AllisonLWoods
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MCaver Founder
Joined: 14 Dec 2001 Posts: 5124 | TRs | Pics
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MCaver
Founder
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 8:33 pm
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marylou wrote: | Heck, we could have a whole forum dedicated to Stewardship and backcountry ethics! |
This is the kind of hiking/outdoor political forum I'm on board with.
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Allison Feckless Swooner
Joined: 17 Dec 2001 Posts: 12287 | TRs | Pics Location: putting on my Nikes before the comet comes |
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Allison
Feckless Swooner
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 8:36 pm
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I'll even volunteer to moderate it if you need help.
www.allisonoutside.com
follow me on Twitter! @AllisonLWoods
www.allisonoutside.com
follow me on Twitter! @AllisonLWoods
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Backpacker Joe Blind Hiker
Joined: 16 Dec 2001 Posts: 23956 | TRs | Pics Location: Cle Elum |
Ok, I think that I practice those kind of things. Help me out here as to how I could be better.
TB
"If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide."
— Abraham Lincoln
"If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide."
— Abraham Lincoln
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Blue Dome Now with Retsyn
Joined: 12 Aug 2004 Posts: 3144 | TRs | Pics Location: Cleaning up the dogma. |
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Blue Dome
Now with Retsyn
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 8:39 pm
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Karen,
Of course you did the right thing by getting tough with the young boys. Without your intervention, the rock throwing would have been forgotten. As was referenced in this thread, K-12, Scouting and other youth programs are when stewardship is best addressed. Establishing awareness at those ages is the best solution.
Your spirited chat with the boys could easily be the spark that triggers their awareness.
Further, your “pass it on” suggestion is spot on. As trite as it sounds, if everybody who cared about the outdoors volunteered for one day (or more) a year to instruct or lead in organizations from Scouting to the WTA to the Mountaineers, the impact would be large.
Recruiting people to participate in stewardship events is important, but creating dynamic programs to recruit other people to instruct or lead in stewardship events may be more important.
“I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell.”
— Harry S. Truman
“I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell.”
— Harry S. Truman
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Allison Feckless Swooner
Joined: 17 Dec 2001 Posts: 12287 | TRs | Pics Location: putting on my Nikes before the comet comes |
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Allison
Feckless Swooner
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 8:41 pm
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If people wanted to do that, we might be able to cook up some contacts and guidelines for what to teach among ourselves.
Personally, I do not want this board to turn into a club, but we could for sure pool a bit of research if people were maybe interested in that.
www.allisonoutside.com
follow me on Twitter! @AllisonLWoods
www.allisonoutside.com
follow me on Twitter! @AllisonLWoods
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#19 Member
Joined: 17 Dec 2001 Posts: 2197 | TRs | Pics
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#19
Member
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 9:26 pm
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Quote: | per Karen Do what you can and what you know. Pass it on. |
That can work. I learned not to cut switchbacks from some older guys with ice axes when I was not much older than godlygirl. These guys were so cool. They wore knickers and chammy (sp) shirts. The were probably all of 26. But when they pointed out the problem of erosion from cutting switchback, my buds and I listened. We didn't question it. We learned because we wanted to. After some of the exchanges today on the tubs thread, I'm not so sure how many people are willing to learn and accept what their responsibility is. (not you gg, you are doing fine). But I guess we can always try. I have taken out quite a few less experienced people over the years and I am always surprised at how little people that are not avid know.
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Quark Niece of Alvy Moore
Joined: 15 May 2003 Posts: 14152 | TRs | Pics
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Quark
Niece of Alvy Moore
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 9:41 pm
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PAP wrote: | I have taken out quite a few less experienced people over the years |
You mean you kilt 'em? Man, that's harsh treatment.
First check what is already being done. There may already be mechanisms in place that are simply not utilized to the full extent.
NWIA puts interpretive information at trailheads, but I don't know if they put How-To information at trailheads. Also, see who, in the FS is responsible for their How-To signs at trailheads. As you know, the FS doesn't have a lot of money, so their stewardship awareness program simply might need a boost of volunteerism.
I'm not volunteering to do any of this. Just so you know.
"...Other than that, the post was more or less accurate."
Bernardo, NW Hikers' Bureau Chief of Reporting
"...Other than that, the post was more or less accurate."
Bernardo, NW Hikers' Bureau Chief of Reporting
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#19 Member
Joined: 17 Dec 2001 Posts: 2197 | TRs | Pics
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#19
Member
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Mon Aug 23, 2004 9:53 pm
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Quark wrote: | PAP wrote: | I have taken out quite a few less experienced people over the years |
You mean you kilt 'em? Man, that's harsh treatment. |
No, not kilt, more like a forearm shiver.
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