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MtnGoat
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Location: Lyle, WA |
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MtnGoat
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 Fri Aug 03, 2018 6:37 pm |
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| Doppelganger wrote: | | Alright then, let's move on - regardless of causation, the plan for remediation should not be a point of debate I assume? This is probably more important, once we fix things we can review the history lessons and learn from them (or ignore them as we tend to).
Here's to another twenty years of arguing. Ready set go! |
Of course it should be a point of debate. There's no need for remediation of what isn't a problem.
Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
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Malachai Constant
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"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
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Randito
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Joined: 27 Jul 2008
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Location: Bellevue at the moment. |
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Randito
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Fri Aug 03, 2018 9:07 pm |
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| MtnGoat wrote: | | Of course it should be a point of debate. There's no need for remediation of what isn't a problem. |
Perhaps not for you, but what about people living in Micronesia, Bangladesh, Miami, New Orleans and other low lying areas that will be inundated by rising sea levels?
( you agree that warming is happening, but are skeptical that human CO2 emissions are the cause)
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Ski
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Ski
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Sat Aug 04, 2018 11:29 am |
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So I counted up 0 fatalities caused by global warming in the last century -- see your list of animal attacks above with Sharks, Bears and Gators averaging 1 fatal attack per year. Global warming is averaging 0.0 while humans are averaging 17,000
But yes tell me again how global warming is the big danger we need to guard against.
"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach.
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach.
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
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Randito
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Location: Bellevue at the moment. |
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Randito
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Sat Aug 04, 2018 1:29 pm |
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| Ski wrote: | | So I counted up 0 fatalities caused by global warming in the last century -- see your list of animal attacks above with Sharks, Bears and Gators averaging 1 fatal attack per year. Global warming is averaging 0.0 while humans are averaging 17,000
But yes tell me again how global warming is the big danger we need to guard against. |
Current estimates are 400,000 additional deaths per year worldwide to climate change, projected to rise to 600,000 per year by 2030
https://newrepublic.com/article/121032/map-climate-change-kills-more-people-worldwide-terrorism
But of course the vast majority of those affected don't live in R leaning congressional districts.
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MtnGoat
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Location: Lyle, WA |
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MtnGoat
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Sat Aug 04, 2018 8:00 pm |
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| RandyHiker wrote: | | Perhaps not for you, but what about people living in Micronesia, Bangladesh, Miami, New Orleans and other low lying areas that will be inundated by rising sea levels?
( you agree that warming is happening, but are skeptical that human CO2 emissions are the cause) |
If there is no human causation, remediation of non causes won't help them, right?
Did you mean aiding with the other impacts to these folks? I'm not sure I see where you're going with this point
Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
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MtnGoat
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MtnGoat
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Sat Aug 04, 2018 8:03 pm |
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Let's take this report at face value, a huge freebie for the argument
What it shows is that the way to help them in the most organic manner possible is to allow them to use the cheapest means possible to get richer as fast as possible, and reach the wealth status to use their resources to ameliorate their risks.
Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
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Randito
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Location: Bellevue at the moment. |
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Randito
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Sat Aug 04, 2018 11:59 pm |
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| MtnGoat wrote: | | If there is no human causation... |
Interesting attitude. There was no "human cause" of smallpox -- so we should have made no effort to understand and eradicate it?
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thunderhead
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The yearly deaths legitimately attributable to human caused warming is low but nonzero. It is clearly not 400,000 but likewise is clearly not zero. Of course when you factor in reduced cold deaths and increased crop production in some locations, the net affect on human health could be positive.
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MtnGoat
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MtnGoat
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Mon Aug 06, 2018 12:37 pm |
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| RandyHiker wrote: | | Interesting attitude. There was no "human cause" of smallpox -- so we should have made no effort to understand and eradicate it? |
Sure we should have. We understood what to do.
Deciding you want to stop the climate from changing is a more complex issue.
We're not helping them by standing in the way of those poor nations who should a able to build and use cheap reliable energy like everyone else did, to improve their productivity, wealth creation, standard of living, and along with those things, their ability to ameliorate and reduce weather related problems
Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
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Randito
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Location: Bellevue at the moment. |
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Randito
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Mon Aug 06, 2018 1:05 pm |
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drm
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drm
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Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:43 am |
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| thunderhead wrote: | | The yearly deaths legitimately attributable to human caused warming is low but nonzero. It is clearly not 400,000 but likewise is clearly not zero. Of course when you factor in reduced cold deaths and increased crop production in some locations, the net affect on human health could be positive. |
The problem with this is that the positive effects on ag are going to be in countries that are not so hot - countries with a temperate climate. Even more so for reduced cold deaths. By contrast, whatever deaths you would acknowledge are happening are happening are almost certainly not in temperate countries, they are in tropical countries that were hot pre-warming. The linked report says that 90% of the deaths are in Africa and India. And they aren't from heat, they are mostly from the spread of disease and negative impacts on ag, i.e. in places where the temperature is already at the upper range that crops thrive in, where additional CO2 will not help. And those countries are not the ones that put the greenhouse gases in the atmosphere.
So looking at this issue only in aggregate is probably not a very fair way of evaluating the issue.
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thunderhead
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True. Global warming will not be fair to every community.
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Randito
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Randito
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Tue Aug 07, 2018 11:22 am |
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| thunderhead wrote: | | It is clearly not 400,000 |
Clear to whom? What's your source of information?
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gb
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gb
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Tue Aug 07, 2018 4:37 pm |
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| MtnGoat wrote: | | RandyHiker wrote: | | Perhaps not for you, but what about people living in Micronesia, Bangladesh, Miami, New Orleans and other low lying areas that will be inundated by rising sea levels?
( you agree that warming is happening, but are skeptical that human CO2 emissions are the cause) |
If there is no human causation, remediation of non causes won't help them, right?
Did you mean aiding with the other impacts to these folks? I'm not sure I see where you're going with this point |
MG is either just argumentative or is extremely unaware. Blinders work but only for the blindfolded.
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