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touron
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Joined: 15 Sep 2003
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Location: Plymouth Rock |
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touron
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 Mon Jun 08, 2009 7:24 pm |
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It would be interesting to explore how one gains an appreciation for the dangers that nature can hold, and also how one can lose a sense of these dangers. Some people are born with a more inborn fear of the wild and our sense of it is presented to us in different segments of our lives. I remember going up to Mt. Rainier when I was little. We drove across the box canyon. I asked what a box canyon was. Someone mentioned that if you fall into a box canyon, you don't get out until you reach the ocean. So that was probably a bit of an exaggeration, but it made a deep impression.  On the other hand, if you fall into that box canyon, you are probably a gonner in a minute or two. Either way, I had this big respect for box canyons!
Touron is a nougat of Arabic origin made with almonds and honey or sugar, without which it would just not be Christmas in Spain.
Touron is a nougat of Arabic origin made with almonds and honey or sugar, without which it would just not be Christmas in Spain.
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Smokey
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Joined: 10 Nov 2002
Posts: 792 | TRs | Pics
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Smokey
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Mon Jun 08, 2009 9:34 pm |
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| The Angry Hiker wrote: | | I think it made him less appreciative of his blessings. |
That seems a bit of a cliche. Kind of like saying poor people don't work hard enough. Just because you're born into a little money you're predestined to be less appreciative? I don't think so.
Considering he gave all his family money away and was living from odd job to odd job, I think an argument could be made he was not an "arrogant little rich kid."
The only reason we've heard of Chris McCandless is because Krakauer needed a new subject to earn a buck.
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Yana
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Joined: 04 Jun 2004
Posts: 4212 | TRs | Pics
Location: Out Hating |
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Yana
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Mon Jun 08, 2009 9:35 pm |
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I guess I'm one of the few that doesn't think McCandless was an idiot for getting himself killed. As Edward Abbey wrote:
| Quote: | | A venturesome minority will always be eager to set off on their own, and no obstacles should be placed in their path; let them take risks, for godsake, let them get lost, sunburnt, stranded, drowned, eaten by bears, buried alive under avalanches - that is the right and privilege of any free American. |
However, what really pisses me off about him is the way he cut off contact with his family, and for years they did not know where he was, what he was doing, and at times whether or not he was even still alive. I understand that his relationship at the very least with his parents wasn't that great, but what he did could only be accomplished by a egotistical, selfish, ungrateful jerk.
PLAY SAFE! SKI ONLY IN CLOCKWISE DIRECTION! LET'S ALL HAVE FUN TOGETHER!
PLAY SAFE! SKI ONLY IN CLOCKWISE DIRECTION! LET'S ALL HAVE FUN TOGETHER!
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Grizzy
Yellow Cedar Hugger
Joined: 16 Jul 2006
Posts: 1936 | TRs | Pics
Location: Switchbacks |
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Grizzy
Yellow Cedar Hugger
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Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:18 pm |
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| Yana wrote: | I guess I'm one of the few that doesn't think McCandless was an idiot for getting himself killed. As Edward Abbey wrote:
| Quote: | | A venturesome minority will always be eager to set off on their own, and no obstacles should be placed in their path; let them take risks, for godsake, let them get lost, sunburnt, stranded, drowned, eaten by bears, buried alive under avalanches - that is the right and privilege of any free American. |
However, what really pisses me off about him is the way he cut off contact with his family, and for years they did not know where he was, what he was doing, and at times whether or not he was even still alive. I understand that his relationship at the very least with his parents wasn't that great, but what he did could only be accomplished by a egotistical, selfish, ungrateful jerk. |
All the birds have flown up and gone;
A lonely cloud floats leisurely by.
We never tire of looking at each other -
Only the mountain and I. ~Li Po~
All the birds have flown up and gone;
A lonely cloud floats leisurely by.
We never tire of looking at each other -
Only the mountain and I. ~Li Po~
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Josh Journey
a.k.a Josh Lewis
Joined: 01 Nov 2007
Posts: 4836 | TRs | Pics
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Nice quote Yana! 
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nuclear_eggset
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Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 2206 | TRs | Pics
Location: Eastside |
| Yana wrote: | | However, what really pisses me off about him is the way he cut off contact with his family, and for years they did not know where he was, what he was doing, and at times whether or not he was even still alive. I understand that his relationship at the very least with his parents wasn't that great, but what he did could only be accomplished by a egotistical, selfish, ungrateful jerk. |
There is a time and place for cutting off contact with your family. While I don't think that - from what I know of it - he was in that place or at that time, he certainly seemed to feel that way. And I know, from personal experience, that there are good reasons to sever a relationship even with 'family' such as your parents, even for people are aren't egotistical, selfish, ungrateful jerks.
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Malachai Constant
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Joined: 13 Jan 2002
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Location: Back Again Like A Bad Penny |
In my mind it will always be a classic. It addresses the universal themes present in all the worlds epics. To go all Joseph Campbell on you, "When a man leaves his mother and a woman leaves her home" the discovery of self etc. What is so great about this story is that it shows that things can go horribly wrong. That not all heroes are successful, that the dangers are real, and they will destroy you unless you are very good and lucky. We have seen too many Luke Skywalkers who have triumphed against incredible odds, it is time to see the reality of the quest. What about all those bodies in front of Grendel's lair, who were they? What was their story? If there is no tension or danger the victory is nothing. Questers must remember however that failure is the norm and those who fail are neither remembered or idolized but only mourned by the family they left behind. For every El Cid there are a hundred Don Quixotes.
"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
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Yana
Hater
Joined: 04 Jun 2004
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Location: Out Hating |
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Yana
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Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:40 am |
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I don't find "he certainly felt that way" to be any sort of adequate excuse whatsoever for his behavior, and I understand that there are good reasons for ending relationships with relatives. However, I was not making a general statement, I was speaking specifically about him.
PLAY SAFE! SKI ONLY IN CLOCKWISE DIRECTION! LET'S ALL HAVE FUN TOGETHER!
PLAY SAFE! SKI ONLY IN CLOCKWISE DIRECTION! LET'S ALL HAVE FUN TOGETHER!
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Stefan
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Joined: 17 Dec 2001
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Stefan
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Tue Jun 09, 2009 1:46 pm |
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| Yana wrote: | | I guess I'm one of the few that doesn't think McCandless was an idiot for getting himself killed. As Edward Abbey wrote: |
Then ask yourself this philosophical somewhat relational events:
Josh = McCandless?
Maybe not the family thing you alluded to. At least Josh is asking questions, I never met McCandless so I don't know if he asked questions before he set off on his adventure.
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Dayhike Mike
Bad MFKer
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Posts: 10958 | TRs | Pics
Location: Going to Tukwila |
| Stefan wrote: | | Josh = McCandless? |
If he doesn't get the training he needs, then yeah, he could likely end up as a needless statistic.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke
"Ignorance is natural. Stupidity takes commitment." -Solomon Short
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke
"Ignorance is natural. Stupidity takes commitment." -Solomon Short
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UGH
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Joined: 02 Jun 2004
Posts: 154 | TRs | Pics
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UGH
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Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:41 pm |
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What pissed me off was when he gave away $24,000 to Oxfam. The stupid little punk throws away all his savings, actually his parents' money, to feed a bunch of Africans so they can survive to make 12x more Africans who will only starve to death while depleting the world's resources.
Also the movie didn't show it, but in the book it mentions that if he'd gone down the river a 1/4 mile or so, he would have seen a cable strung across the river that would have allowed him to escape. But he didn't think to scout the river, and I can't say I would have either.
Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean someone isn't out to get you.
Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean someone isn't out to get you.
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Tag Man
side hiller
Joined: 20 May 2008
Posts: 602 | TRs | Pics
Location: Where the roots all twist... |
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Tag Man
side hiller
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Tue Jun 09, 2009 9:16 pm |
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| Lulu wrote: | | It's one thing to ask questions and incorporate the feedback into your decision. Something completely different to ask a question when you have no intention from the onset of taking any minutia of the advice. |
Good point, isn't that about the same thing as being a troll?
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Josh Journey
a.k.a Josh Lewis
Joined: 01 Nov 2007
Posts: 4836 | TRs | Pics
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| UGH wrote: | | What pissed me off was when he gave away $24,000 to Oxfam. The stupid little punk throws away all his savings, actually his parents' money, to feed a bunch of Africans so they can survive to make 12x more Africans who will only starve to death while depleting the world's resources.
Also the movie didn't show it, but in the book it mentions that if he'd gone down the river a 1/4 mile or so, he would have seen a cable strung across the river that would have allowed him to escape. But he didn't think to scout the river, and I can't say I would have either. |
Wooow woooow..... so are you saying it's bad to donate money to charity? Or only charities to Africa?  If that were true, money would have even less meaning to me!!! But I guess it was his paretns money so I guess I understand your point of view.
Well it's funny when the place you did'nt look, that's were it is. He did'nt know that, so it does'nt matter if it's 1/4 a mile or a million miles away from the bridge, and I don't blame him for not finding it, because to me it seemed a bit random for there to be one.
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Josh Journey
a.k.a Josh Lewis
Joined: 01 Nov 2007
Posts: 4836 | TRs | Pics
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| Tag Man wrote: | | Lulu wrote: | | It's one thing to ask questions and incorporate the feedback into your decision. Something completely different to ask a question when you have no intention from the onset of taking any minutia of the advice. |
Good point, isn't that about the same thing as being a troll? |
As reply of me being a troll..... well first off with the Camp Muir deal, you guys did'nt tell me don't go in a blizzard, although that's a given, but just because I did that, doe'nt mean I did'nt listen to your guys advice, if I did'nt, I would have went to Sloan, and perhaps other dangerous places, but I know better know. Now I don't mean for this question to sound rude, but what advice of you guys have I been ignoring? After the Camp Muir trip I have'nt done much dangerous since....
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nuclear_eggset
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Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 2206 | TRs | Pics
Location: Eastside |
| Flow wrote: | | UGH wrote: | | Also the movie didn't show it, but in the book it mentions that if he'd gone down the river a 1/4 mile or so, he would have seen a cable strung across the river that would have allowed him to escape. But he didn't think to scout the river, and I can't say I would have either. |
Well it's funny when the place you did'nt look, that's were it is. He did'nt know that, so it does'nt matter if it's 1/4 a mile or a million miles away from the bridge, and I don't blame him for not finding it, because to me it seemed a bit random for there to be one. |
I'm going to agree with UGH - you want out of a situation, you try every FLIPPIN' THING POSSIBLE. If that means scouting that river (and moving base camp) every day, well, you do that. You can get a long way if you keep traveling forward, rather than back and forth.
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