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Tom
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Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 17851 | TRs | Pics
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Tom
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 Tue Sep 29, 2009 11:43 am |
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Big Steve, as far as HR exits coming out the Suiattle, we've been wanting to do a high route that involves going in via Lyman to Bannocks and coming out Bath. The main problem with that or any HR that comes out the Suiattle is the 12 mile road walk out. I can't imagine doing it without bikes. You'd almost want to coordinate someone going in the other way and swap keys / bikes.
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DIYSteve
seeking hygge
Joined: 06 Mar 2007
Posts: 12655 | TRs | Pics
Location: here now |
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DIYSteve
seeking hygge
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Tue Sep 29, 2009 11:55 am |
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I hear ya, Tom. Several years ago I was planning a Lyman>Bannock>Bath HR, but I postponed my plans pending the road issue. I saw your Bannock TR. Very cool.
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Tom
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Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 17851 | TRs | Pics
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Tom
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Tue Sep 29, 2009 11:59 am |
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| Dayhike Mike wrote: | | The road is closed at Mile Post 12. That car shouldn't have been there and was there illegally.
<snip>
There's really no reason for simply closing the road at MP 12. |
Actually, if they had a permit it was legal. It was too dark to see if they did. That said, I'm not sure what official business they would have been on.
As far as reasons for closing the road at MP 12, I suspect the FS doesn't want too many vehicles driving up there making the road worse where it's carved into the hill or getting too close to the sidecut embankments. I could easily see someone going over the embankment in the dark. Also, I'm not sure if the NEPA requirements Kim mentioned prevents them from allowing access.
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Vertical Smile
Member
Joined: 21 Jul 2009
Posts: 27 | TRs | Pics
Location: Great Northwest |
| Dayhike Mike wrote: | | Kim Brown wrote: | | I know of at least one party who hired a chopper-drop to hunt up there last fall. |
Is that even legal? Maybe in BC, but I'm pretty sure our Wilderness regulations don't allow for that. |
I believe there is a certain distance you have to be from the boundary.
Did you guys see any signs of wild life on your trip. It sure looks like a nice trip.
Re-duce,
Re-use and
Recycle
Re-duce,
Re-use and
Recycle
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Kim Brown
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Joined: 13 Jul 2009
Posts: 6899 | TRs | Pics
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You can chopper over Forest Service lands outside of Wilderness boundaries in the U.S.
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
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Tom
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Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 17851 | TRs | Pics
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Tom
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Tue Sep 29, 2009 12:27 pm |
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Vertical Smile, we didn't see any wildlife (other than deer prints here or there). I was a bit surprised. I thought for sure we'd see a bear. However, we generally stay on the go the whole time (other than stopping for lunch and camp). I'm sure if we stayed in a spot for a while we would have seen more wildlife than we did.
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Dayhike Mike
Bad MFKer
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Posts: 10958 | TRs | Pics
Location: Going to Tukwila |
| Kim Brown wrote: | | Last summer, JimK and I walked along the river at the former bridge site, and I stepped in a pool of quicksand. I sunk to mid-calf and needed help getting out! |
I think I found that quicksand, just upstream from the snarl of logs and old iron girder. A quick step backwards saved me from getting too deep, but it was like stepping into a pool of thick water.
| Quote: | | If you guys had second thoughts on that river crossing, then it must be pretty scary. |
It was definitely on the edge of "iffy". Felt a lot better about the crossing coming back. Just need to lean a bit into the flow to keep your balance and be reeeeeeeally sure of your foot and pole placement with EVERY step.
| Quote: | | at least 2 trees back there have been identified as being among the largest of their kind by the UW's Robert Van Pelt). |
Saw one HUGE tree blown down across the Milk Creek trail just a mile or so from the old bridge crossing (top of the switchbacks). It was bigger than anything I'd ever seen.
I have no idea if this was one of the trees in question, but I have no doubt that there are some big trees back there.
| Quote: | | The Suiattle area will be relatively lonely for another season; the Milk Creek area - who knows how long? No plans are currently in the works for a bridge there. |
Crossing the Milk Creek was a snap in comparison to some of the bushwhacking / route finding in the deep brush. I hopped across on slick rocks before we realized that there was a mostly intact bridge just slightly upstream. If someone's gotten across the Suiattle, they're not going to be intimidated by the Milk crossing at all.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke
"Ignorance is natural. Stupidity takes commitment." -Solomon Short
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke
"Ignorance is natural. Stupidity takes commitment." -Solomon Short
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Dayhike Mike
Bad MFKer
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Posts: 10958 | TRs | Pics
Location: Going to Tukwila |
| Kim Brown wrote: | | You can chopper over Forest Service lands outside of Wilderness boundaries in the U.S. |
Yeah, but actually touching down to drop off gear / passengers. That's still verboten, correct?
I'm referring to this bit:
| Kim Brown wrote: | | I know of at least one party who hired a chopper-drop to hunt up there last fall. |
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke
"Ignorance is natural. Stupidity takes commitment." -Solomon Short
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke
"Ignorance is natural. Stupidity takes commitment." -Solomon Short
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Dayhike Mike
Bad MFKer
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Posts: 10958 | TRs | Pics
Location: Going to Tukwila |
| chiwakum wrote: | | I'm heavily biased towards the notion of how reduced access to popular areas really tends to make the areas more pleasant. |
Trust me, walking the overgrown Milk Creek Trail was not "pleasant". Adventurous, yes, but not a picnic and no walk in the park.
It was fun/novel/interesting to see how the wilderness was reclaiming the trails, but I don't think it'd be all that unpleasant to have more people up in the area.
I'd much rather have people out and about, seeing that country and communing with nature, than sitting at home or doing Pilchuck/Mount Si because they don't have 4-5 days to dedicate to the effort.
I'd also rather have people able to safely visit the area without having to worry about fording the river, route find down an abandoned/unmaintained trail, and/or riding their bikes back in the dark with dim headlamps on a washed out road.
Come to think of it, I didn't find any of those activities particularly "pleasant".
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke
"Ignorance is natural. Stupidity takes commitment." -Solomon Short
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke
"Ignorance is natural. Stupidity takes commitment." -Solomon Short
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chiwakum
not credible
Joined: 29 Jun 2009
Posts: 980 | TRs | Pics
Location: Ballard |
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chiwakum
not credible
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Tue Sep 29, 2009 1:49 pm |
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Ok, DHM, I really appreciate your point of view. Balancing access/abuse is definitely a complex topic. I'll try to stop being so obsessive about.
Regarding the crossing of the Suiattle. Do you think the water levels were relative constant throughout the day or would have they been lower in the early morning?
I know you guys say you didn't have fun battling overgrown trails and riding the road in the dark but it sounded kind of fun to me. Anyway great trip and report, one I would consider epic for the likes of me.
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sky_pilot
Member
Joined: 29 Apr 2009
Posts: 55 | TRs | Pics
Location: Seattle |
Looks like you two had a fun trip. Sorry to hear it was so unpleasant for you.
For a more pleasant Wilderness experience you could try this hidden gem in the ALW. I don't want to give away the sekrit location, but I'll bet you could PM Jasper for beta if you have trouble finding it on your own.
| Jasper wrote: | As we were nearing the area referred to as Slippery Slab Falls, we heard a loud rumble. As we rounded the corner we saw what all the commotion was: 2-leggers galore |
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pimaCanyon
Member
Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Posts: 1304 | TRs | Pics
Location: at the bottom of the map |
Great TR and stunning photos! Congratulations on overcoming some serious obstacles and completing a great route!
I did this trek with a few friends in the mid-1980's. We camped high on Fire Mountain then did a very steep descent (think ice axes for self-belay on steep grass) down to the bench where the high route started. We'd come in via Meadow Mountain, did the high route in the reverse direction that Tom and Mike did and dropped down to the Suiattle. 'Course then you could drive to both trailheads, so we'd spotted a car at the take-out.
Tom may be correct in stating the photos oversell the area. My memory is that the lakes were nice, but the most stunning scenery was up on Fire Mountain.
I think doing the route now, though, without the road access of yesteryear would be a big plus. It turns what used to be a nice high route into something of an epic.
It's never too late to have a happy childhood
It's never too late to have a happy childhood
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pimaCanyon
Member
Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Posts: 1304 | TRs | Pics
Location: at the bottom of the map |
| Dayhike Mike wrote: | | Kim Brown wrote: | | You can chopper over Forest Service lands outside of Wilderness boundaries in the U.S. |
Yeah, but actually touching down to drop off gear / passengers. That's still verboten, correct?
I'm referring to this bit:
| Kim Brown wrote: | | I know of at least one party who hired a chopper-drop to hunt up there last fall. |
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They could legally chopper in to right up next to the Wilderness Boundary, right? I'd have to look at a map to see where the boundary is, whether it's on the road side of the river or the other side.
It's never too late to have a happy childhood
It's never too late to have a happy childhood
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Dayhike Mike
Bad MFKer
Joined: 02 Mar 2003
Posts: 10958 | TRs | Pics
Location: Going to Tukwila |
| chiwakum wrote: | | Balancing access/abuse is definitely a complex topic. |
This is something I think most of us can agree upon. 
| Quote: | | Regarding the crossing of the Suiattle. Do you think the water levels were relative constant throughout the day or would have they been lower in the early morning? |
Tom mentioned that he thought they were higher on our second visit, i.e. 4pm vs. 2pm. But I didn't really notice any major difference between any of the timeframes.
| Quote: | | I know you guys say you didn't have fun battling overgrown trails and riding the road in the dark but it sounded kind of fun to me. |
I really didn't mean to come off as whining. It was definitely an adventure and enjoyable in that respect, but suffice it to say that I have really no urge to retrace my steps and do battle with the brush up the valley any time soon.
And the bike ride in the starlight might seem enjoyable, but after a long day on trail, you really just want to be out.
(To be honest, the joy kinda wears off after the first 100 minutes of sitting on the hard bike seat, hunched over, craning your neck back, straining your eyes staring off into the darkness, cold wind whipping past your head and neck, as you pedal your way down a washed out road.  )
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke
"Ignorance is natural. Stupidity takes commitment." -Solomon Short
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke
"Ignorance is natural. Stupidity takes commitment." -Solomon Short
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JPH
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Joined: 14 Feb 2008
Posts: 808 | TRs | Pics
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JPH
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Tue Sep 29, 2009 8:17 pm |
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Oh well, aren't they fixing the road next summer anyways?