Forum Index > Public Lands Stewardship > Geothermal Energy in WA (Split from Garland HS Thread)
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Ringangleclaw
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PostSat Oct 01, 2011 9:42 am 
Probably less than meaningless. The understanding of Washington's geothermal resource potential is incomplete even now, 1974 (with the work probably dating to a year or two prior to that ) is the stone age. Also there has been quantum changes in the cost of basic energy and of energy production, particularly in Washington, and the end of the gilted hydro-power age. The political landscape has also changed, with calls for domestic power and "green" power. Do we need to talk about technology and how it has changed since 1974?

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Allison
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PostSat Oct 01, 2011 10:00 am 
Thanks for posting that, Mike. An interesting read. As a hot springs aficionado, I've always been disappointed that the subduction zone didn't apparently produce a necklace of hot pools.

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Ringangleclaw
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PostSat Oct 01, 2011 10:40 am 
Active magmatic arcs are crustally thickened. Many hotsprings in North America are found in areas undergoing active extension such as Nevada and the Great Basin. Further areas have undergone extension, or are affected by hotspots such as the Yellowstone Plume.

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Mike Collins
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PostSat Oct 01, 2011 12:56 pm 
Ringangleclaw wrote:
Probably less than meaningless
Please show me something meaningful then. What is needed is information deeper than the depth of a double-click. A study with actual numbers would be useful.

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Ringangleclaw
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PostSat Oct 01, 2011 2:53 pm 
You want data on what? If they are preparing to drill to depth, you'll have plenty of information soon enough. It is apparent that someone believes the sub surface geology and geophysics is favorable to a geothermal exploration

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Slugman
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PostSat Oct 01, 2011 4:33 pm 
Funny how you say data from 1974 is "less than meaningless", yet you quote a study from 1975 to back your assertions. huh.gif That, coupled with your "Dr. Woods" (snarky) comments, makes me think you are a hypocritical asshat who has no idea what he is talking about. It appears that you are the one engaging in "mindless blabbering based on nothing." down.gif down.gif PS: no whining, either, about how someone is being mean to you, since all I'm doing is throwing your own jerkiness and hypocrisy back in your face. And you acted like a jerk to someone who did nothing to deserve it, nothing at all, yet you richly deserve what I'm saying now. Maybe if someday you ever add any hiking content to this website, any at all, there might be a reason to un-"ignore" you. Maybe.

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Allison
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PostSat Oct 01, 2011 5:22 pm 
Check is in the mail.

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Ringangleclaw
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PostSat Oct 01, 2011 5:50 pm 
Slugman wrote:
Funny how you say data from 1974 is "less than meaningless", yet you quote a study from 1975 to back your assertions. huh.gif That, coupled with your "Dr. Woods" (snarky) comments, makes me think you are a hypocritical asshat who has no idea what he is talking about. It appears that you are the one engaging in "mindless blabbering based on nothing." down.gif down.gif PS: no whining, either, about how someone is being mean to you, since all I'm doing is throwing your own jerkiness and hypocrisy back in your face. And you acted like a jerk to someone who did nothing to deserve it, nothing at all, yet you richly deserve what I'm saying now. Maybe if someday you ever add any hiking content to this website, any at all, there might be a reason to un-"ignore" you. Maybe.
fencing.gif Lovseth was the first to name the Darrington-Devils Mountain Fault Zone, thereby it is often referred to as "the DDMFZ of Lovseth....). The fact that this occurred in 1975 does not change anything. It is the equivalent of naming a geographic feature. Mount Rainier is still Mount Rainier, even though it was named in 1792. As another example. It is common to refer to the Skagit Gneiss, Shuksan Schist and Northwest Cascade System of Misch (1948). His petrologic and structural relations hold with minor changes to this day. But one would be inadvised to invoke Misch's (1948) orogenic model of a vertically driven eugeosnyclinal flower structure as the derivative force of NW Cascadian thrusting. Geophysical data and the economics of geothermal power production have changed markedly in the last 35 years. Base-, precious metal and petroleum production sites which were referred as economically non feasible 30 years ago are now in production because of changes in costs. The same is true of geothermal production.

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rap
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PostMon Oct 10, 2011 4:26 pm 
The Garland geothermal project is moving forward. A new well is being planned and further land (another acre) will need to be clear cut for the new phase. In the meantime, it has been learned that the new transmission poles will cost $8.147 million for construction from Garland to the grid. Despite the exactness of the number, the PUD still maintains that it does not know the route. The smart money is on the county owned Index-Galena road. That road is one third to one-half shorter than the Beckler route, which is the only other way to get the power out. The Beckler route runs over Jack's Pass and is on USFS land. Both routs will require large swaths of trees be cut for the poles. The Garland site is also limited in size and may not accommodate a plant of the size that the county envisions. There are rumers that the county is looking into other private holdings in the area (the Skyko 3 & 4?) for other plants and wells. Of course everything depends on the sucess of the current operation.

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Schroder
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PostMon Oct 10, 2011 5:12 pm 
They have to build the road first and that's on quite a different timetable than the PUD.

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Zipper
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PostMon Oct 10, 2011 10:37 pm 
I received this in my email from Garey Markley of Sultan, Washington. I thought it was of interest to share here. I am an electrician who lives in Sultan, Wa. and I attended the Methodist Church in Sultan with Cam Sharpe. I attended the church summer camp there around 1960. What Fred has told you is true, as I know it. I talked to Cam about the generator, since that is my interest, and he also said that someone stole the copper wire in the generator windings, along with the wire that carried the electricity throughout the camp. The swimming pool was fed with spring water, and looked very bad. I recently went up there to work for Boert-Longyear, the company contracted by Snohomish County P U D to drill a test well down 5,000 feet to see what temperature the water is, to see if it is feasible to use it for geo-thermal generation. The road for the drilling operation goes right in front of several of the standing existing cabins. I saw about 7-10 cabins still standing, with metal roofs intact. The drill rig is right next to the river, near where the Lodge and swimming pool were. The actual ground they were on is now a part of the river. I was surprised at how many cabins were still standing. The way the river is migrating, they may not be for long. The drive is about 30 minutes from Skykomish, up the Beckler River Road, over Jack Pass, and down the other side toward Index. The road from the Index side to Garland is still washed out, so that way is not viable. Please forward this on to Fred, and send me the pictures you have of Garland. If I get up there again, I'll try to take some current pictures. > > Thanks, Garey Markley, Sultan, Wa., markleyelectric@frontier.com, 360-793-0670 Fred Seifert

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rap
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PostSat Oct 29, 2011 10:46 am 
You l can say "goodbye" to Garland as you all remember it and "hello" to miles of rusting pipes and a huge, sulphyurous steam-belching concrete, geothermal-plant if the Snohomish County PUD has it's wish come true. With all the big rivers damned, the Snohomish county PUD is moving to grab and develop the small untouched rural areas like Garland. In fact it sees the entire upper valley of the N. Fork, Skykomish and most of the Beckler river valley as one big electricity development. While damns are being removed elsewhere, the PUD is moving towards building small-hydro dams at Canyon and Sunset Falls. By now everyone knows of the destruction taking place at Garland as the PUD franically drills 24-7 into the Earth's crust, looking for the geothermal bonanza they believe exists. If they strike it rich at Garland, the geo-rush will be on. With the proof of rich pay-water at Garland, wildcat drillers will move into the entire area from around Garland to Harlan Creek, where the dirt road starts on the Beckler river road. The PUD has allready made nominations for the companys. You don't hear a lot of this because the PUD doesn't want to put out fires before they have started. Also you don't hear of the damage such geothermal efferts are causing worldwide in other so-called-green renewable energy projects. Creig Collar, the Jolly-Green-Giant, of the PUD is running all over the state making speeches and setting up county web sites, all of which only extoll the vertues of geothermal energy. Meanwhile geothermal sites all over the world are being shut down because of a number of problems. They cause earthquakes for one, and the release of numerous hazzardous materials such as sulphurous steam and arsenic. They also loose money like crazy. Google Iceland, Swizerland and San Fransisco geothermal earthquakes. The PUD never brings up the huge swath of trees that will need to be cut to make room for the transmission lines and poles, nor the miles of pipes and feeder wells into the main plant. The entire Index to Garland to Snohomish to Index loop will be forever changed. You be the judge if it is for the good or just more senseless developement.

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mgd
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PostSat Oct 29, 2011 10:51 am 
Isn't there already a generator at Sunset Fall?

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rap
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PostSun Oct 30, 2011 7:00 am 
Google the Oct. 12th Sky Valley News. You look around and see trees and mountains, the PUD sees megawatts.

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Sore Feet
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PostSun Oct 30, 2011 12:40 pm 
mgd wrote:
Isn't there already a generator at Sunset Fall?
Nope, there's a DFW trap and haul facility used to move fish above the three falls on the river. Under the PUD proposal they would build the power house next to the trap station and take over its operation. Given that the PUD doesn't like the public traipsing around their facilities, I'd say chances are any hope of restoring public access to that side of Sunset Falls (something that American Whitewater has been attempting to do for over a decade) would be lost too.

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