[NacMacFeegle]

There are many roads in national forests that serve little recreational purpose. Eliminating those roads that don't access trailheads or other points of interest would direct funds toward the maintenance of more important roads.

[RumiDude]

As an aside (or an attempt to hijack this topic), this stuff tends to just piss me off. Why? Because it takes all the fun out of back country recreation for me. Let me explain. At the age of 61, I still have a huge level of 10 yo boy deep down inside. I like to walk on logs, ford rivers, explore cool things, sit quietly taking in the wonder of a meadow, giggle inside at hearing the bugle of an elk bull just 20 feet away, ... I have almost no wonkish bureaucrat inside me. I can barely remember the number of the road I drove yesterday. I know where I have to turn and stuff, I just have no interest in remembering the number names of the roads. But there is more than just remenbering road numbers, it seems like I also need an understanding of the various regulations which govern our network of USFS roads, as well as all the other land managers involved in our network of access roads. I have learned stuff over the years, but the more I learn the more I realize the huge bureaucratic mess of regs I have no hope of ever comprehending. It certainly doesn't help that so much of these regs are couched in specialized technical terms and a mamoth list of acronyms and abbreviations. This brings me to the point of trying to educate myself about these issues. Where do I get information? Where do I start? I learn a lot from well informed people here. But frankly, sometimes the info here can also be wrong or at the very least slanted. Wading through government PDFs is an exhausting task. And now they ask me to make comments. I am overwhelmed at the idea of actually making an informed comment about roads in ONF, let alone comment on roads in Mt Baker NF, etc. And I don't think I am the only one overwhelmed. And then the land managers scold us later when we complain about our favorite road being closed/decomissioned, stating that there was a comment period and they only got XX number of comments. The implication is we have no right to complain unless we submitted a comment. So who makes comments on these types of issues? First of all would be those in advocacy groups like OPA, OFC, Audubon Society, etc. Next would be those in industry groups. And then thre are those who are just plain anoraks about stuff like this. The average backcountry recreationist is ill-equiped to make comments about these types of issues. I hope I have explained my frustration in an understandable manner. Maybe I should have started a separate thread on this subject. Anyway, I just want to register my feelings about this. Rumi

[Kim Brown]

Rumi The ONF has a really good FAQ page that cites the actual regs, and provides links. There are the public meetings as well. MBS had many public meetings about the process and local not for profits were involved who invited their members to ask questions. So - get with the organizations you belong to, attend Open Houses, check out their websites, and get on the horn to ask questions of either the orgs you belong to who are involved, or the Forest Service point person.

[Ski]

[509]

[Kim Brown]

[treeswarper]

Apathy? No. The lack of a new, not from here FS group not understanding how to notify folks. They put an announcement in the Chehalis newspaper. Not many of us get that. Word got out via the rumor mill. A few days before the meeting, the phone lines and cell tower was buzzing with folks calling about the plan to close most of the forest. It was kind of a nasty rumor. I found out the time and date and made a few small posters and put them up where the people go and see stuff-the Post Office Door, the mini marts, the grocery. That was a part of the meeting, telling the FS where to put notices. I do see meeting announcements now in the White Pass Shopper, which is free and available at every business in the east county area. It also disappears faster during the winter, when it is needed to start fires in wood stoves. Anyway, our meeting was packed with people. Industry, Back Country Horsemen, mill workers, etc. They had it during the evening, but still early enough that timber fallers could sit through it and stay awake. I don't think anybody from the Vancouver based Gifford Pinchot Task Force, which are advocates for road closures, was there. That might have been a good thing. We also have a little group of ATV advocates, who show up for every meeting open to the public that they can. They'll even go to timber sale meetings just to make a statement about wanting more trails open to them. Gotta admire their perserverance.

[MyFootHurts]

[cairn builder]

/\ rabies.

[MyFootHurts]

/\ brain damage.

[Randito]

[RodF]

[treeswarper]

[RumiDude]

[Hulksmash]