[mountainsandsound]

Saw this post come up so I thought I'd add my 2 cents if it could be of help to someone. I have a 30* Prodigy Quilt (looks like the Enigma is the new version) that I've had for 3 years so far. I am 6'2" and I got a tall, wide. I'm not a thick guy, but the wide is nice because I do tend to turn around a lot in my sleep and generally sleep on my side, and the extra width keeps the quilt from coming up off the ground and letting cold air seep in from the bottom. I also had them use 20 denier nylon for the outer and inner layer rather than the thinner 10 denier to increase the durability. I have been comfortable in this down to the upper thirties, but no colder. IMO, this quilt is the best sleeping option I've ever had during high summer when overnight temps are 40 and above in the backcountry. If I'm not sleeping in a tent, I do prefer a traditional sleeping bag to keep some of the draft out as well as the bugs. This is not what I want for an open bivy except in pretty select conditions. But for tent camping in summer this is my go to every time and I'd happily make the same purchase all over again.

[Adohrn]

Here is a picture of the weather resistant stripes.

[Backpacker Joe]

Thanks Ad. I was thinking about getting a black exterior and black strips! Not an issue then I guess. Im thinking about a brown interior. I like enviro colors. Black will help the bag dry out in the sun faster. I was thinking about a Revelation, 950-20 degree bag, standard everything else. Interesting side note; when I chose the Conundrum, it didnt offer the 20 strips option.

[Adohrn]

I don't even remember the Condrum. Wonder if its new? No 20d stripes, but still offers 20d exterior. This won't speak well of me but I'am one of those kind of people who would read through every last review of a product. One consistent regret that I noticed was active sleepers should have ordered a size wider than actually needed. Mountainsandsound has the 20d both interior and exterior which is no longer being offered. I remember reading somewhere that was because of breathability issues. So I guess the question is Mountainandsound do you have any condensation issues with your quilt? The durability of the 20d did have some sway on my decision of exterior fabric, but using it with a tarp was the the deciding factor. I have a revelation, 950, 20 degree, regular, wide, exterior black 20d , interior charcoal 10d (it's actually kind of a brown/grey if this makes any sense) and due to a mix up that I called and corrected but never was corrected steel grey weather stripes. At first I was a little shocked but have started to really like it. Did the same thing looked for dark colors that would dry fast. I also want to be able to put the quilt on a rock at lunch, and be very inconspicuous about it. Other than that it looks pretty and is begging to be used.

[mountainsandsound]

Adohrn- I asked for the 20d in exterior and interior and they were fine with it. It wasn't an option at checkout as I recall, but they have the fabric available and were happy to make the whole quilt with 20d. I talked with them over the phone about it and breathability issues did not come up. I can say that having spent 20-30 nights in the quilt in a variety of conditions I have never had a problem with condensation. I believe that most sleeping bags you can buy are still using 20d or 30d fabric and you don't hear too many problems with condensation unless a bivy sack is thrown in the mix. I think the truth is the whole ultralight thing is driving some serious marketing hype whereby people feel they need to buy gear like they are attempting to break a thru hike record or something. The quilts are already plenty light. I'd rather add another ounce for a more durable product and keep a misplaced toenail or rock from ripping a hole in 10d fabric.

[DIYSteve]

DWR sorts works until it doesn't. EE makes nice quilts for a good price, but it's too bad it doesn't offer a close-to-waterproof/breatheable shell, e.g., Pertex Shield EX, which FF uses for its winter and expedition bags. I custom spec my FF bags with it or equivalent.

[Adohrn]

BigSteve you definitely know more about this than I do. Here is the info from the EE web site. There is also a fair bit of talk about it on Backpacking light, but this sums it up. What’s the difference between the 10D and 20D fabric? Both fabrics have a Durable Water Repellent (DWR) treatment and have a great feel and low weight. The 10D fabric favors minimal weight and maximum breathability as its highest priorities, whereas the 20D offers somewhat higher durability and water resistance at the cost of a bit more weight. In most cases with careful use the 10D fabric will be your best option, though if you tend to be somewhat more exposed to the elements in your camping style, the 20D will offer some added protection. Both 10D and 20D fabric options should be treated with care. Phantom 10d - ultralight Phantom 10D nylon is the perfect choice for the smoothest feel, lightest weight, and excellent breathability. Phantom 20d - This ripstop nylon is the most durable fabric that we offer. It has a DWR treatment applied to the face that will resist water, keeping your quilt drier. Why can’t I use 20D fabric on both the inside and outside of my quilt? While it’s tougher and more water resistant than our standard 10D fabric options, our 20D fabric also doesn’t breath as well. When using two layers of it, this restriction can make your quilt more clammy, and makes packing the quilt more frustrating since air can’t escape quickly enough to easily compress the quilt to a smaller size. What are the Weather Resistant Stripes? If you’re frequently dealing with condensation on your tent walls and from your breath, the 20D weather resistant stripes can offer some additional moisture resistance at the head and foot of the quilt (as compared to the 10D fabric). This combined with a 10D selection for the shell adds approximately 1 oz of weight vs 2 oz for selecting 20D fabric for the whole shell of the quilt.

[mountainsandsound]

Interesting. I wonder if the 20d on my quilt is just regular ripstop then. I don't recall the 20d being DWR when I bought mine, I thought that only came with the weather resistant stripe option at the foot of the quilt. Regardless, I'm somewhat skeptical that DWR treated 20d would really have a breathability issue, considering sleeping bag manufacturers use weather resistant materials for the shell that are far more robust, weather proof, and presumably less breathable than simple 20d DWR. If they say so I guess.

[DIYSteve]

Yeah, I don't get it. 20D and 30D uncoated ripstop have been used on millions of sleeping bags, including some of mine. I've never heard anyone claim that DWR impairs breatheabilithy and IME it does not. 20D ripstop w/DWR (Pertex Endurance branded) is Feathered Friends' standard shell for lightweight and midweight sleeping bags. See http://featheredfriends.com/fabrics/ Western Mountaineering uses DWR-treated 20D nylon taffeta (branded Microlite XP) on its standard sleeping bags. See http://www.westernmountaineering.com/product-details/materials/ Seattle Fabrics sells 1.1 oz. 30D ripstop, describes it as "Perfect for a sleep bag quilt." See http://www.seattlefabrics.com/nylons.html. I've made lots of stuff from this fabric, and it breathes great. As I mentioned above, I spec'd most of our FF bags with a WB laminate shell, which offer much more water protection from the outside but at the cost of far less breatheability (when compared to 10D, 20D or 30D) and they work fine for me with some tricks, e.g., turn the bag inside out to get the down bone dry before packing.

[ndiggs]

Sell your bag, you can recover quite a bit of what you paid and get the quilt. Plus the quilts are much more affordable than anything at REI so it might be a wash. What type of bag would you be getting rid of? I may be able to give you some tips for selling. I just got my hands on an EE revelation 20 deg (xlong, wide). It weighs less than my 30 deg Mt Hardwear Phantom (cost less too), it packs down a little bulkier probably because it is a little larger and stuff more full of down than the phantom. I've used it only for a night (got it a week ago) but it was amazingly comfortable on a warm night...where my mummy bag would've been opened too but all awkward. Looking forward to putting it to the test more often.