[Cohokiller]

[Ski]

bear in mind the Boistfort slide and the Oso slide - another episode like that will really be a black eye for DNR. I think it would be wise to err on the side of caution. if it's stable, it's stable. just wondering if they've checked it out. as I said: I don't know the area.

[Schroder]

This is all east of the falls and I would be very surprised if it had any visual impact from the trails to the falls. Most of this area was clearcut back in the 50's and was all replanted with hemlock. IMO it needs to be cut again so they can diversify some of the species in that area.

[Daryl]

When i hike Wallace falls I go up the popular falls trail, then continue up to the lake, then loop it with the DNR roads back (12 mile day). Rarely see more that a handful of people off the falls trail. The DNR roads have areas that had already been logged, the were actively logging when i went through there once a few years ago. i think that's out of the park though?

[treeswarper]

Ski, where is your proof that the Oso slide was caused by a timber sale? I have never heard that as a final cause from any geologist. Let's not get that mixed up in this. I looked it up in my Forest Practices Illustrated book and the buffer meets the requirements. For state and private, there is a 50 foot no cut area on each side of a fish bearing stream. Then more buffer that machinery must be kept out of, but a few trees taken out of. I suspect that is just a map of the harvest units. No roads or landings. Landing locations can be changed, and for the better sometimes, if the logger has different equipment...like a bigger yarder than the planners used. The leave trees could blow over. Then they become rat logs (down, woody material). The units will be replanted as required by law. I'm not sure what the contour line intervals are, but much of that doesn't look overly steep. I noted that instead of using the normal "old growth" description, the petition mentioned "old" trees. The document mentions 70 year old trees which would mean the area either burned in the past or was harvested 70+ years ago. I'd like to know which before getting all worked up. Were slides a problem in the past? Loss of property values? By golly I should be in panic mode if logging causes that to happen. Our community has units in plain sight all over the place. I have not noticed any drop in property values. In fact, according to the county assessor, values have gone up. I think my "next door" neighbor is going to log this fall. Should I be panicking? Would the Sky Valley go for having their property taxes raised to make up for revenue lost if the timber sales were thrown out? And finally, when does it end? What and where do folks want timber harvest to occur? It can't be done in a "pretty" way on a large scale, and nature sure doesn't worry about visual quality--think windstorms, slides, floods, volcanic eruptions. At the rate folks on here seem to want to go, we'll be importing more lumber from countries that have NO stream buffers, or laws, but I guess that's OK because it can't be seen from here.

[Ski]

[treeswarper]

That's a 50 foot no cut, except for corridors and road crossings. This timber is left on site--not yarded in. Then there is an inner zone, which for a river would be a minimum of 100 feet off that 50 feet, where 20 trees greater than 12 inches DBH per acre must be left. It looks like they want a feathering effect with the cut getting lighter as one gets closer to the no cut zone. then we have the outer zone, which is a minimum of 50 feet wide, where the same amount and size of trees is left, but these can be dispersed or clumped throughout the 50 foot space. From a yarding perspective, it can be easier to work around clumps of trees, than single trees. Clumps are also more wind tolerant. All of that is a minimum. Now, out to take a kayak deck apart. Bah.

[Schroder]

[goldbarchuck]

I received an end of the legislative season email from our local representative, he featured a photo of Wallace Falls in his newsletter. These falls are an iconic view from US2. I see it like preserving the Mona Lisa and only trimming out her eyes with an dull exacto knife. I think the DNR has done a disservice by not showing the limits of the logging on an oblique aerial photo so the average person can put it in perspective. The element that needs to be remembered is that the roads built for this lower sale are intended to provide access to a future timber sale higher on the hill side. Thanks for those that read this thread. I have my photos and plan at least one more photo excursion next fall when the water flow returns and before the chainsaws do their work. I once heard that Ansell Adams was in favor of a cable car to the top of Half Dome, he had his iconic photo. I watched as it took forty years for the management errors on the I-90 corridor to greenup and actually blend. Hike on.

[puzzlr]

[treeswarper]

Management error? How so? At the time, those areas were managed for timber harvest. It was reforested successfully, right? Eyesores? Doesn't cut it if you want wood products. Thinning is not the right prescription for every piece of land.

[Randito]

I think the management error of clear-cutting heavily along I-90 is the amount of anti-logging sentiment that it generated among folks that might otherwise know or care about such things. From a rational perspective logging those lands may have made sense, but the emotional and political fallout for timber concerns was much greater than the value of the timber felled. IMHO anyway.

[joker]

[Ski]

to be fair: maybe my memory is failing me, but... wasn't a good part of that cutting up along I90 done by Plum Creek prior to the big land swap deals up there? I have to wonder if assigning all the blame to DNR (or NFS) is perhaps just a wee bit misguided. (I may have my wires crossed here... not really awake yet.)

[joker]

Regardless of who did it, my sense is that the result impacted attitudes towards logging by various parties.