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Snowbrushy
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PostTue Aug 04, 2015 11:31 am 
"In 1909, the use of heliography for forestry protection was introduced in the United States. By 1920 such use was widespread in the US and beginning in Canada, and the heliograph was regarded as "next to the telephone, the most useful communication device that is at present available for forest-protection services". D.P. Godwin of the US Forestry Service invented a very portable (4.5 lb) heliograph of the single-tripod, shutter plus mirror type for forestry use." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heliograph

Oh Pilot of the storm who leaves no trace Like thoughts inside a dream Heed the path that led me to that place Yellow desert stream.
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Chico
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PostWed Aug 05, 2015 6:32 pm 
Then they began to string wire.

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Snowbrushy
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PostWed Aug 05, 2015 7:45 pm 
In heliography they used morse code and the sun had to be out. Maybe they also used morse code in wired telegraphy between lookouts.

Oh Pilot of the storm who leaves no trace Like thoughts inside a dream Heed the path that led me to that place Yellow desert stream.
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Chico
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PostWed Aug 05, 2015 8:21 pm 
Snowbrushy wrote:
Maybe they also used morse code in wired telegraphy between lookouts.
The telephone was coming into widespread use so probably not.

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Snowbrushy
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PostWed Aug 05, 2015 8:31 pm 
You're probably right, Chico. I wonder how much power is needed to send a telegraph message from a remote place? A car battery? (Inquiring minds want to know.) http://www.telegraph-office.com/

Oh Pilot of the storm who leaves no trace Like thoughts inside a dream Heed the path that led me to that place Yellow desert stream.
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Snowbrushy
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PostThu Aug 06, 2015 5:03 am 
Here is an interesting webpage about early Forest Service communication. http://www.foresthistory.org/ASPNET/Publications/region/1/flathead/chap8.htm

Oh Pilot of the storm who leaves no trace Like thoughts inside a dream Heed the path that led me to that place Yellow desert stream.
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Kirt
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PostThu Aug 06, 2015 6:13 am 
^ cool webpage SnowBrushy. That was an interesting read. Thanks for sharing.

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Chico
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PostThu Aug 06, 2015 6:51 am 
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Snowbrushy
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PostThu Aug 06, 2015 8:01 pm 
Chico wrote:
More -
Thanks Chico. If you guys like signals, etc. boy do I have a learning experience for you - http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/BoyScouts/AdvancementandAwards/MeritBadges/mb-SIGN.aspx This would be a good one to learn - practice with a drone. 8 e.
Helicopter Marshalling Signals
Helicopter Marshalling Signals

Oh Pilot of the storm who leaves no trace Like thoughts inside a dream Heed the path that led me to that place Yellow desert stream.
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Snowbrushy
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PostSat Aug 08, 2015 1:45 pm 
The importance of signals out in the field (mountains) goes on to this day. Once in the 80's I was skiing at Crystal Mountain ski resort where I had learned to ski with the Jack Nagel Ski/Race School. At lunchtime I went to the lodge and took my hot dog and coffee outside by the ski patrol entrance to eat, which was my routine. It was slightly breezy and the tree limbs were moving along Silver Creek. Clouds hung over the PCT. As I finished the dog I heard the sound of a distant helicopter. I looked down the valley and there was the sight of a helicopter slowly coming toward the resort. My eyes were fixed on it. Then, through the ski patrol door came a guy about my age wearing his red patrol parka. He only walked a few feet away where he stopped with his eyes also fixed on the bird. The helicopter came up above us when the ski patrol guy, eyes seemingly glued to the cockpit area, began with a helicopter marshalling hand signal to hover. Using more signals he brought the helicopter down on the deck and waited while a patient was loaded. And then the copter took off with a loud power turn over the resort and quickly disappeared. Knowing at least a few of these signals can probably help a pilot in the mountains should you ever need it. Perhaps a remote lookout requires a helicopter visit. Signals are important to this day. Copy the below and keep it in your first aid kit. You never know. Be Prepared!
Helicopter Marshalling Signals
Helicopter Marshalling Signals

Oh Pilot of the storm who leaves no trace Like thoughts inside a dream Heed the path that led me to that place Yellow desert stream.
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flash
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PostSat Aug 08, 2015 5:24 pm 
James C. Urquhart 1917
1 label
James C. Urquhart 1917
Jones 1916
Jones 1916
USFS 1913
USFS 1913
Keuffel & Esser USFS Heliograph
Keuffel & Esser USFS Heliograph
US Forest Service Godwin Heliograph
US Forest Service Godwin Heliograph
Links to larger photos: [ Urquhart 1917 ] [ Jones 1916 ] [ USFS 1913 ] [ K&E Helio ] [ Godwin Helio ] Per: The Clearwater Story: A History of Clearwater National Forest, which has a B&W version of this photo, your photo (repeated above) is of James C. Urquhart, a forest ranger in the Clearwater National Forest, Idaho, in 1917, with the double-tripod heliograph. James had a long career in the Forest Service - he was a forest supervisor in the 1940s. Another Clearwater forest ranger relates his experiences in 1917-1920 with both the full-size double-tripod heliograph shown above, and the smaller single-tripod Forest Service model mentioned in your post in: The Forest Service Heliograph. There's a beautiful photo of a Boy Scout using the smaller Forest Service single-tripod heliograph in 1938 on Facebook here. ( I suspect the person behind the Scout is the fire lookout, and the building the lookout tower - I know there was one on that mountain.) The second photo was taken by G. Allen Burrows in 1916 . You can read his journal online: The Odyssey of a Cornell Forestry Student to the Idaho Selway National Forest in the Summer Season of 1916, and read his personal (illustrated!) account of using a heliograph here: Chapter 11: The Heliograph, which describes (and includes a diagram of) the simplified code the US Forest Service used in place of Morse Code. The prior account alludes to that code as well. Another description of the simplified code is in the Scientific American Supplement (1918) The third photo is a USFS photo of a forest ranger in 1913 using a double-tripod heliograph. To see how the double-tripod heliographs in the photos above were transported, setup and used, see this movie of a demonstration by US Marines in 1915: Heliograph Drill The fourth photo is a modern photo of a double-tripod USFS heliograph in a private collection [ K&E Helio ], and the fifth is a photo of the single-tripod USFS Godwin heliograph [ Godwin Helio ]. To learn more about the use of the heliograph by the US Forest Service from 1909 through the 1940s, read: A Brief Overview of the use of the Heliograph in US Forest Protection and view the gallery: US Forest Service Heliographs An excellent contemporary reference (1920) is Chapter 8, "Heliograph" (22 pages, including photos of both single and double-tripod heliographs, and tables for the Morse, Myer, and simplified USFS codes) in: Methods of Communication Adapted to Forest Protection by Willis Norman Millar Oh - and if you stop by the Fire Lookout Museum in Spokane, they have three USFS heliographs on display.

Carry a signal mirror, a whistle, and consider a PLB. PLBs are less than 6oz, less than $250, or rent for under $50 a week.
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Chico
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PostSat Aug 08, 2015 9:04 pm 
Welcome to the forum! Used them into the 40's? With telephones would never have thought. We never stop learning.

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Chico
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PostSat Aug 08, 2015 9:26 pm 
So, the men didn't want to learn the codes. Plus the problems with using them. That meant getting telephones in and the faster the better. Only problem was keeping the wire up.

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flash
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PostSat Aug 08, 2015 10:16 pm 
> Used them into the 40's? With telephones would never have thought. The forest service lookouts were using the telephone even before they first tried heliographs in 1909[1]. I expect that the key to the surprising longevity of the heliograph in the USFS was its ability to allow communication from mobile units to base, something the telephone did not do well (though USFS crews did carry phones that they could "clip on to" the USFS phone lines, which must have been a big help). The fact that the forest service went to the trouble of inventing and manufacturing the small heliograph reinforces the point that the key role of the heliograph was for mobile communications - small weight was a minor consideration for fire tower equipment. Of course, the readily available large heliographs were fine for use at the fire towers. What really started the decline of the heliograph for the forest service was the advent of man-packable radios, which was in the early 1930s. Since the USFS radios were "drafted" for military use in the 1940s, that may have delayed the final retirement of heliographs. The man-portable (initially, more of "mule-portable") radio finally gave mobile crews an option to communicate to base from the field. I did read one report of a fire lookout using a heliograph in the 1950s, though. The use of sun-mirror signaling by fire crews, in vestigial form, continues to this very day - signal mirrors are still used for fire crews to communicate their locations to air support. Here is an example Flickr Link
Trinity Ridge (West) Fire, Idaho City, Idaho, Boise National Forest, August, 2012; Black Mountain Hotshots; using a signal mirror to flash the pilot to locate sling site
Trinity Ridge (West) Fire, Idaho City, Idaho, Boise National Forest, August, 2012; Black Mountain Hotshots; using a signal mirror to flash the pilot to locate sling site
[1] The Salt Lake tribune. (Salt Lake City, Utah), 16 July 1909, p 1 column 5, 2nd to last article Chronicling America: Historic American Newspapers. Lib. of Congress. http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/lccn/sn83045396/1909-07-16/ed-1/seq-1/ MAY USE HELIOGRAPH FOR FOREST PROTECTION --------------- WASHINGTON, July 15. - In order to ascertain whether the heliograph can be successfully utilized in the national forests to report fires and transmit other messages in areas where there is no method of quick communication, experiments will be made during the summer with instruments used by the United States army in the Kaniksu national forest of Idaho and in the Stanislaus forest in California, If satisfactory the heliograph will be used to supplement the telephone lines and other means of communication in the forests where easy and quick communication in connection with the fire patrol is essential for protection against fires on the 195,000,000 acres of national lands.

Carry a signal mirror, a whistle, and consider a PLB. PLBs are less than 6oz, less than $250, or rent for under $50 a week.
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contour5
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PostSun Aug 09, 2015 2:44 pm 
Ah, signal mirrors. They used to be a "must have" item. I carried one in my pack for a couple of decades...

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