[Pyrites]

I'm getting mine next week. Best

[Lono]

I go my shot a couple weeks ago during a routine exam, first in probably 8 years. I have been selfish and have neglected the flu vaccine for years, not because I'm impervious to the flu but have felt the odds are against my contracting it. I had flu of some sort last year, and it was bad enough. I come into contact with a lot of mixed populations including caretaking of my mom and some kid exposure, and also in shelters with random people in them. I never had any doubt that I should be vaccinated against Hep A and B so why not the flu? The reports of the supposed negative effects I've seen have been fairly insipid so I don't think there's any real risk there. If the flu came on full bore, folks wouldn't be so shy as I have been, and would be crestfallen to infect their spouses or kids or family and friends with something that could be so preventable. I had grandparents who could recall 1918 and the sheer terror that reigned back then - boys saved from the front lines of WWI, but dying behind the lines in camps and hospitals on the way home. The flu gets immeasurably worse the more people that you know that have it - and for the most part, we have all avoided epidemics for years and years so our fear about the flu isn't built up as it should be.

[the Zachster]

In the mid 70's there was a swine flu epidemic and everyone was told to get vaccinated, so I did. Unfortunately, there was a problem with the vaccine that year and indeed, I got the swine flu. I've never been so sick in my life, down for about 2 weeks. Because of that, I swore I'd never get another flu shot ever again. And for years I've never gotten the flu or the shot. But I have come to agree with graywolf completely. I'm NOT concerned about myself, but I work with people all day that I really don't want to inadvertently infect. Plus, my Mom is very senior and a flu would be devastating for her. So please consider it for others even if you're not worried about yourself.

[GaliWalker]

I used to never get a flu shot, until I got the flu two years running. Since then, I've always got the flu shot - got this year's shot a month ago. This way, if I get the flu I can still tell myself that I tried my best to prevent it...

[More Cowbell]

[Jake Neiffer]

BigSteve- The 4K to 8K is Canadian numbers, not US. The 36,000 number has been changed to a range of 3K to 49K, which jives with the first link you posted and is explained in this NPR article. All of these #'s are model generated, the accuracy of which is the Nursing Journal article takes issue with.

[DIYSteve]

[Spotly]

[Jake Neiffer]

[Jake Neiffer]

[DIYSteve]

Well, the NPR article was hearsay, but thanks for posting the archived page. Note that the 36,000 number is an average of 9 years ending 1998-99, i.e., quite old data. It appears that per the CDC the trend is that when H1N1 or influenza B are dominant, the CDC fatality numbers are much (90%?) lower but when H3N2 strain of influenza A is dominant the CDC fatality numbers are up to 10 times greater. AFAICT, the CDC think this ostensibly wild disparity is based on good science. So, it's appearing to me that the problem here is that some reporters are reaching back and grabbing old numbers and/or using numbers from H3N2/influenza A dominant years and ignoring 90% lower fatality numbers in years when H1N1 or influenza B are dominant. The former makes better, albeit less accurate, news, and provides a cherry-picking opportunity for anti-innoculists. So, maybe this "order of magnitude" you claim is a matter of whether H3N2/influenza A is dominant vs. H1N1 or influenza B. The article you linked in your OP seems make things even more muddy. Again, note that the archive pages includes the disclaimer, "CDC does not know exactly how many people die from flu each year."

[DIYSteve]

FTR, I am not suggesting that we should ignore the issue re whether flu shots are pushed too on too many people. It's a valid question, but IMV it's not advanced by sloppy journalism. Also, to those talking about herd immunity, do enough people get flu shots to result in any meaningful widespread herd immunity effect? (I acknowledge that small scale herd immunity might be at work where, say, 98% of residents in a retirement home receive flu shots.)

[DIYSteve]

[Jake Neiffer]

Steve- good thoughts, I’ll respond later. But for those of you suggesting everyone get flu shot to protect others, I applaud your intentions but I’m afraid it’s not so simple. The CDC has only been recommending universal flu coverage since 2010. In fact, up until 2000, they only recommended it to those 65 and over. (That year the age was lowered to 50). They have continually expanded the recommended age range for flu vaccination during those “confusing” 36K death years. Sure appears to be at least some hype and marketing. The point there is no data on someone who’s received the flu shot annually (starting from in utero) for 40 consecutive years. We’re likely starting to get some good data on acute reactions, but how do we know it doesn’t make some people become unhealthier in the long run? If you think it’s completely benign, well I guess you have more faith than me. I don't believe a lot of grandparents would advocate their grandchildren getting a flu shot for 60 straight years. I have no proof for this obviously. But I would bet for the overall optimization of public health, a quite small % of the population receiving the flu shot would be ideal. We’ll probably know in 50 years.

[cartman]