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HitTheTrail
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PostMon Oct 31, 2016 6:44 pm 
This valve for transferring gas between your backpacking stove canisters may already have been discussed here but I could not find it in a search so here goes. It is a valve with two Lindal thread openings so you can safely move gas from one canister to another. This is handy if you have a bunch of half used canisters and want to move the gas to make a full one. Also, it will allow you to use the larger 500g canisters at a fraction of the gas cost of a 100g and just keep filling the smaller canister after each trip out. You can even use the cheap off brand name large canisters at supermarkets like Fred Mayer to lower your gas costs. I am sure the gas is just as good. The gadget is called a G-works gas saver($21) or gas saver plus($32). The gas saver plus has a fancy button on the side to release gas vapor in the canister being filled but I am not sure it is worth the extra money. There are tons of them for sale on ebay but I would recommend getting one from Amazon to insure the quality. Also, check out the other Lindel valve adaptors listed on Amazon.
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Riverside Laker
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PostMon Oct 31, 2016 6:57 pm 
Do you heat up the full one, and cool the empty one, to get more fuel in there? Might as well take advantage of the ideal gas law.

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HitTheTrail
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PostMon Oct 31, 2016 7:07 pm 
The company that sells the thing is an instruction free zone but I listened to some vids on youtube. They all said to put the bottom canister in the freezer for an hour or so and put the top one out in the sun for the same length of time. Some also said to just turn the valve on and go to bed and it will eventually fill. I didn't do either and it seemed to fill ok. It makes a big difference what the differential is between the two gas volumes.

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Randito
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PostMon Oct 31, 2016 7:37 pm 
HitTheTrail wrote:
This is handy if you have a bunch of half used canisters and want to move the gas to make a full one.
Have you had much success with actually doing that? -- from reports I've read about refilling 1lb propane tanks from bulk propane tanks that getting the 1lb tank about half full is about as far as it goes -- even with putting the empty tank in the freezer overnight.

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Malachai Constant
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PostMon Oct 31, 2016 7:59 pm 
Good luck guys, I draw the line at refilling disposable cylinders. Like my house and hair too much. eek.gif as the King of the Hill says, "propane is a cruel mistress".

"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
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moonspots
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PostMon Oct 31, 2016 7:59 pm 
HitTheTrail wrote:
This is handy if you have a bunch of half used canisters and want to move the gas to make a full one.
Won't work. Without a pumping system, the best you can do is fill each canister with 1/2 the volume of the two canisters in total. The "freezer/sun" bit might distribute the total gas in slightly disproportionate volumes, but I'd guess not by much.

"Out, OUT you demons of Stupidity"! - St Dogbert, patron Saint of Technology
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HitTheTrail
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PostMon Oct 31, 2016 8:03 pm 
RandyHiker wrote:
Have you had much success with actually doing that?
When I got this thing I had 6 or 7 canisters laying around with anywhere from 20g to50g of gas in them. Now I have one that is full. In fact I tried to top it off with a full canister and got it over full by about 10g. Using the gas vent button I could get them down under 5g of gas and that was without using the cooling/warming trick. Under 5g I just vented them off with the button and punctured them for recycle. My primary plan is to use a larger 500g canister to keep my 100g canister at around 50g each time I go out. That way I can shed a few ounces and will always have enough gas for cooking and coffee.

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moonspots
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PostMon Oct 31, 2016 8:08 pm 
HitTheTrail wrote:
RandyHiker wrote:
Have you had much success with actually doing that?
When I got this thing I had 6 or 7 canisters laying around with anywhere from 20g to50g of gas in them. Now I have one that is full.
Well, shut my mouth! Empirical evidence indicates that my understanding of physics is incorrect someway...unless you went out and *bought* a new, full canister. embarassedlaugh.gif

"Out, OUT you demons of Stupidity"! - St Dogbert, patron Saint of Technology
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HitTheTrail
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PostMon Oct 31, 2016 8:19 pm 
The gas in the top canister is a liquid and is being pushed by gravity and the partial pressure of the gas vapor. The bottom canister has a vent button to release the vapor pressure in a one way valve so it is gravity and vapor on top vs vapor being vented on bottom. Gravity wins. BTW, I have a minor in physics.

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moonspots
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PostTue Nov 01, 2016 7:27 am 
HitTheTrail wrote:
The bottom canister has a vent button to release the vapor pressure in a one way valve so it is gravity and vapor on top vs vapor being vented on bottom. Gravity wins.
The "weight" of the mass of liquid in the top canister (in addition to the vapor pressure) is sufficient to overcome the vapor pressure in the bottom canister enough to fill the bottom canister? And the bottom canister is vented to where? Outside? I don't have a minor (or major) in physics, I'm just loosely comparing this to filling a tire from an air tank, where eventually (if left connected together with no intervention from me), both will come to the same pressure. This seems implausible, so I'm trying to sort it out correctly. I'm assuming though that there has to be some threshold of imbalance in the mass of liquid in each canister at the start? Would this work to completely fill a canister that is ~ 75% full from one that is say 25 or 30% full? Can you explain how this works in more detail so I can follow it? Thanks.

"Out, OUT you demons of Stupidity"! - St Dogbert, patron Saint of Technology
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forest gnome
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PostTue Nov 01, 2016 7:36 am 
unfortunatlelly this is a total waste of time and effort....half or less full canisters, and it's stupid dangerous...yes I have tried several methods.. and the barista who had 2 kids but was filling indoors died from burns.... I'm giving this two down.gif down.gif ...REALLY STUUUPID!! down.gif down.gif

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Backpacker Joe
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Backpacker Joe
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PostTue Nov 01, 2016 8:06 am 
While I appreciate the information, Ill just use and old one till it dies and bring a replacement. Thanks HTT.

"If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide." — Abraham Lincoln
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HitTheTrail
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PostTue Nov 01, 2016 8:30 am 
moonspots wrote:
Can you explain how this works in more detail so I can follow it? Thanks.
Sorry, I didn’t mean to be snarky and Dalton’s law of partial pressures has not crossed my mind in over 40 years. I was just testing out what appeared to be a nifty piece of gear I happened to read about on the internet. I figured they would not sell them if they didn’t work somewhat. The vent button vents gas vapor from the bottom canister only to the outside air. In fact, it seems to vent some gas also if you are not careful. From my observation as the gas in the bottom canister greatly exceeds gas in the top canister the transfer efficiency drops off precipitously. However, if you are careful and continue to vent the bottom you can get more gas from the top to flow down. If you want it to exclusively empty small amounts of gas from used canisters into another canister you might be disappointed. I think its value is to top off a small canister with a larger cheaper canister.
forest gnome wrote:
I'm giving this two down.gif down.gif ...REALLY STUUUPID!! down.gif down.gif
As with everything you need to follow basic common sense and safety rules.

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DigitalJanitor
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PostTue Nov 01, 2016 8:56 am 
Too funny, husby has been 'sperimenting with this type of gas transfer widget + some super small/cheap knockoff Chinese stoves. He's inordinately pleased with himself and his ingenuity. I'm sticking with the OH stove if I'm running the show.... I have an irrational paranoia about pressurized fuel systems especially after reading "Polar Dream".

~Mom jeans on wheels
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Schenk
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PostTue Nov 01, 2016 12:57 pm 
Once the gas pressure equalizes between the 2 canisters then gravity will take over and the liquefied gas will drain into the lowest canister. I am sure the valve in question has this feature, a port to constantly equalize the pressure between the canisters. Imagine 2 bottles of water put together the same way: Neck to neck with one bottle on top. There is no need for a pump to get the water to transfer from the top bottle to the lower bottle, especially if you introduce a way for the pressure to stay equalized between the two bottles (a straw in between the necks). Without that equalizing port/passage it would have to bubble and burp as the liquid transfers, but it will still do it. This seems no more dangerous than refilling a butane lighter, and probably safer since you actually have a screw-on valve and you are not just holding a tight fit between the lighter and the refilling container.

Nature exists with a stark indifference to humans' situation.
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