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huron Member
Joined: 13 Sep 2004 Posts: 1038 | TRs | Pics
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huron
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Sat Feb 24, 2018 3:40 pm
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This looks like it was recently eroded from the center of a Tiger Mountain trail not far from the Issaquah shooting range. Its about 3cm diameter. Red rubber/plastic or shiny paint. Looks like a tube or stake going down into the soil. Marked with "P.E.D. Control" in faded black letters. What is it? Found a Wikipedia entry for cave radio system of some sort.
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Joey verrry senior member
Joined: 05 Jun 2005 Posts: 2799 | TRs | Pics Location: Redmond |
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Joey
verrry senior member
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Sat Feb 24, 2018 6:06 pm
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A corner on a land survey is typically marked by driving a length of rebar into the ground and placing a plastic cap on top. The cap will have the surveyor's registered ID number that was assigned by the state.
Maybe something along those lines.
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texasbb Misplaced Texan
Joined: 30 Mar 2009 Posts: 1153 | TRs | Pics Location: Tri-Cities, WA |
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texasbb
Misplaced Texan
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Sat Feb 24, 2018 6:23 pm
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thunderhead Member
Joined: 14 Oct 2015 Posts: 1519 | TRs | Pics
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Performance enhancing drugs? Any russian olympic officials around?
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huron Member
Joined: 13 Sep 2004 Posts: 1038 | TRs | Pics
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huron
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Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:37 am
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Found the answer. It appears to be the control interface point where a signal can be sent to a low frequency antenna that propagates through rock. This can enable a "personal emergency beacon", remote text messaging or initiate remote blasting from surface to mine/cave. Still curious about what signal is being sent or received there.
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hatchetation Member
Joined: 11 Jun 2017 Posts: 37 | TRs | Pics Location: Seattle |
Huron wrote: | Found the answer. It appears to be the control interface point where a signal can be sent to a low frequency antenna that propagates through rock. |
Got a link? I find that unlikely.
It's almost certainly a surveyors control point. These are often set to ensure the stability or accuracy of other set points or construction hubs in the area.
Given that there's a nearby 230kV power transmission system in the vicinity of NW Tiger Mountain, my guess is that the PED stands for "pedestal" and that the marker is probably left over from tower construction.
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moonspots Happy Curmudgeon
Joined: 03 Feb 2007 Posts: 2456 | TRs | Pics Location: North Dakota |
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moonspots
Happy Curmudgeon
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Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:59 pm
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hatchetation wrote: | Huron wrote: | Found the answer. It appears to be the control interface point where a signal can be sent to a low frequency antenna that propagates through rock. |
Got a link? I find that unlikely. |
I find that unlikely also. The only VLF station (which is what is required to transmit "through rock") in Washington is in Jim Lake. And its transmitters generate about 1.2 million watts of energy into miles of wire (its antenna) in order to do that.
I know there is a comm system used in mines and caves, but it doesn't use a rod run into the rock. Now you got my curiosity up, I'll have to look into that to see how it works.
"Out, OUT you demons of Stupidity"! - St Dogbert, patron Saint of Technology
"Out, OUT you demons of Stupidity"! - St Dogbert, patron Saint of Technology
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huron Member
Joined: 13 Sep 2004 Posts: 1038 | TRs | Pics
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huron
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Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:04 pm
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Found another up the trail a way. This one was also dead center on the path.
Joey is correct. A simple survey stake. It was raised 3 inches or so enough to see the rebar. The caps on these things don't look like they will be around for long and I would hate to think that trail runners will be impaling themselves on a 1/2 inch rebar spike. That was my concern.
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RodF Member
Joined: 01 Sep 2007 Posts: 2593 | TRs | Pics Location: Sequim WA |
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RodF
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Wed Feb 28, 2018 1:07 am
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Huron wrote: | Tempted to pull them. |
Unless you have the permission of the land manager, please either pound them deeper into the ground or add fill to raise the tread and bury them.
Yes, safety first but they may have future utility & value which would be destroyed if they were removed. They were put there for a reason (likely a survey). We can't destroy public property (& it's illegal). Please accept my apology for stating this.
"of all the paths you take in life, make sure a few of them are dirt" - John Muir
"the wild is not the opposite of cultivated. It is the opposite of the captivated” - Vandana Shiva
"of all the paths you take in life, make sure a few of them are dirt" - John Muir
"the wild is not the opposite of cultivated. It is the opposite of the captivated” - Vandana Shiva
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Joey verrry senior member
Joined: 05 Jun 2005 Posts: 2799 | TRs | Pics Location: Redmond |
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Joey
verrry senior member
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Wed Feb 28, 2018 5:33 am
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Covering them as RodF suggested is fine.
Surveyors have metal detectors that are 'tuned' to find vertical rebar and they will know approximately where to look if they need to recover (surveyor-speak for "find") those stakes.
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cdestroyer Member
Joined: 14 Sep 2015 Posts: 1251 | TRs | Pics Location: montana |
I was once stationed at rocky point naval transmitter facility NAS whidbey a long long long time ago. The VLF transmitters in the area at that time were near arlington. they were 1.5 million watts and sent signals to subs at sea thru the water and later a very large one was built in upper wisconsin that sent the signals thru the earth..
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DIYSteve seeking hygge
Joined: 06 Mar 2007 Posts: 12655 | TRs | Pics Location: here now |
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DIYSteve
seeking hygge
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Wed Feb 28, 2018 9:14 am
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Yeah, as Joey says and Huron confirms, it's a survey marker. Do NOT attempt to move it or alter it. "Disturbing" a survey marker with intent is a gross misdemeanor in WA. See RCW 58.04.015
Yeah, you can cover it up with dirt or rocks, or place rocks around to warn others of its position.
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Malachai Constant Member
Joined: 13 Jan 2002 Posts: 16093 | TRs | Pics Location: Back Again Like A Bad Penny |
We had a potential dispute with a neighbor and I had the property line surveyed. The surveyor put in a number of flagged wood stakes. I later drove in metal fence posts below the surface next to each stake for future reference on advice of the surveyor. Standard operating procedure.
"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
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DIYSteve seeking hygge
Joined: 06 Mar 2007 Posts: 12655 | TRs | Pics Location: here now |
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DIYSteve
seeking hygge
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Wed Feb 28, 2018 10:04 am
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Malachai Constant wrote: | The surveyor put in a number of flagged wood stakes. |
Surveyors call those "hubs." They are temporary and not considered survey monuments under WA law. If either property was previously surveyed and the survey was recorded (required after enactment of the Recording Act), existing rebar (tack or PK nail if paved) corners would have been confirmed. If there was no existing survey for either property, the surveyor likely would have performed a new survey and set corners with permanent monuments (e.g., rebar, tack, PK nail). Setting corners and recording surveys go hand in hand, i.e., there's no good way to "set a corner" upon which you can rely without having a recorded survey (existing or new). That's the law. If a (post-Recording Act) recorded survey for one or both of the properties already existed, the surveyor would confirm the position of existing corners (99% likely rebar, pipe, tack or PK nail). If the surveyor produced a drawing of the line (standard procedure in the context of a dispute), the drawing will note the existing monuments (if a recorded survey existed). Just because you didn't see the monuments doesn't mean they weren't there. If you want to avoid a future dispute, confirm the positions of the corners (if a recorded survey exists) or (if a recorded survey does not exist) have a recorded survey performed and corners set. Don't rely on temporary hub placement.
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Malachai Constant Member
Joined: 13 Jan 2002 Posts: 16093 | TRs | Pics Location: Back Again Like A Bad Penny |
I am well aware of all that. One of my first jobs out of high school was as an assistant to a surveyor and when in general practice I did several boundary disputes. I know where all the original markers are. Unfortunately the leagal description is meets and bounds. The neighbor was an early MS employee whose wife wanted to raise sheep and he wanted to clear cut the adjacent property on a steep slope all the way to the property line which he claimed was marked by a used diaper in a tree. At that time Issaquah tree cutting restrictions were lax (now you need a permit for anything over 6"). Rather than continue arguing I paid a couple hundred for the survey. The neighbor finally gave up and sold the property but I wanted the boundary clear for the future. Long irrelevant story but fun to tell.
"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
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