[Tom]

They were in a closed area and possibly not following hunter safety protocol. They were also shooting marmots which I'm not sure was legal from a hunting perspective. Beyond that I'm not sure what they would be charged with unless there is proof they were actually shooting at the firefighters intentionally. In the lessons learned I find it curious they do not acknowledge the possibility they put the firefighters in danger by directing them to take off their yellow shirts and hats.

[sooperfly]

[kbatku]

If you are shooting bears, marmots and squirrels you are pretty much just out to kill anything that moves. I'm surprised they didn't include grouse in the menu, plenty of them out there to shoot at too.

[Seventy2002]

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/2-hunters-cited-after-firing-rifles-toward-wildland-firefighters-near-white-pass/ "The incident gained an international spotlight this week after a Melbourne, Australia-based website published an account that portrayed the shooting as a deliberate attempt to target firefighters and erroneously reported that the FBI had sought charges against the hunters."

[Ski]

And in spite of the facts showing that "Wildland Fire Lessons Learned Center" is not part of the U.S. Forest Service, Mr. Loussikian continues to insist that the document cited above was from USFS:

[mb]

sorry, the report is clearly from the FS (or at least FS staff) even if it's posted on an interagency website. why makes you think he didn't talk to the USFS? and newspapers sell now days by stirring controversy. always did actually, but now given that other advertising (the big store circular and the classifieds) are gone, clickbait is what they've got. who knows if the shooters were just shooting anything which moved, or targeting people explicitly; i suspect only they know and won't say. it's often easier for LE to not charge someone for something which can't be proven and takes lots of paperwork. see also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gell-Mann_amnesia_effect

[Malachai Constant]

I have some knowledge of Australian papers and web sites. Most Aussie papers are tabloids on the English model, lots of sports sensationalism and busty half neked women on an iside page and lots of right wing commentary. Exceptions are present, in Melbourne there is The Age a relatively unbiased prestige paper from Fairfax. The Australian is a high class national paper put out surprisingly by Murdock. Aussie papers like US papers are an endangered species due to the Web I.e. no income from ads.

[Tom]

According to the Seattle Times article...

[Ski]

[Ski]

[Tom]

I'm guessing Mr. Loussikian contacted Traci Weaver who confirmed it was FS related personel that submitted the document. Why not contact her? I'd also venture to guess she also set him straight in regards to "no evidence of malicious intent". What do you want to bet?

[Ski]

I have no clue who he talked with. He didn't mention any names, or the locations of where he called. His responses to me via email are all quoted here verbatim. I called the Naches Ranger Station a couple times this morning but could not get a human to answer the telephone. The gentleman I spoke with earlier today on the phone at Wildland Fire Lessons Learned Center was the only one of the four staffers shown on their page who answered the phone. Like I said, I'm trying to be objective about Loussikian's article, but the errata and inclusion of unrelated subjects causes me to question not only the veracity of the article, but motives as well. Hunters shooting people is pretty serious stuff. I don't think we should accept anything less than 100% accuracy in the reporting of incidents like this.

[MtnGoat]

So what we have is the Aussie version of fake news.

[jinx'sboy]

I think there is some misunderstanding about the role of the Wildland Fire lessons learned Center (LLC). While it isn’t a govt agency, it is THE repository for documentation on safety incidents. It may even be funded partly or wholly by the Federal Agencies. I don’t think there is any question that the write up was submitted by either the Incident Management team on the Miriam fire, or the Regional Risk committee. Having spent several stints as a member of Incident Teams, I know how they work. Here is the direction(policy) from the National Interagency Fire Center and the National Wildfire Coordinating Group (which are gov’t. agencies) with regard to documenting safety issues: “Reports will be distributed via the Safety Alert system (if 24-Hour reports are not available in a timely manner, 72-Hour reports are acceptable). The NWCG Safety Bulletins will include reference to the Wildland Fire Lessons Learned Center database. Typically, a Safety Bulletin will read as follows: “Attached is the 24-Hour Report for the __________ incident/investigation/review. Please see that it receives wide distribution within your agency.” When available, other investigation documents, specifically the 72 Hour Report and the Final Report/Review, will be posted on the Wildland Fire Lessons Learned Center (LLC) database for incident reports and lessons learned analyses: “ From the NIFC website: https://www.nifc.gov/safetyAlerts/index.html Whether or not actions of the fire managers on the ground that day were an over reaction, or appropriate, is another discussion.

[Wastral]