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xrp
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PostThu Nov 15, 2018 10:36 pm 
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https://www.oregonlive.com/expo/life-and-culture/erry-2018/11/85efc98d6e9647/3-oregon-wilderness-areas-to-r.html

3 Sisters Wilderness, Mt Jefferson and Mt Washington are the three.
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awilsondc
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 6:25 am 
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Permits, even for day hikers!  eek.gif

Imagine if Mt Si or Colchuck Lake started doing that...
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DIYSteve
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 7:44 am 
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awilsondc wrote:
Permits, even for day hikers!  eek.gif

Imagine if .  .  .  Colchuck Lake started doing that...

Self-issued permits have been required for Colchuck Lake for years, although without any caps on numbers of permits issued.
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treeswarper
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 8:17 am 
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Another nail in the coffin of spontaneity. down.gif

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awilsondc
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 8:23 am 
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DIYSteve wrote:
Self-issued permits have been required for Colchuck Lake for years, although without any caps on numbers of permits issued.

Correct. I guess the cap is the bigger issue.  The article states one area regularly sees 400 hikers on a busy day and they want to cap it to 100.
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Schroder
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 8:28 am 
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All this will accomplish is dump more people on the trails just outside the Wilderness areas.  The quotas they set are arbitrary, subject to a few people's interpretation of requirements for solitude.
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Stefan
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 8:55 am 
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This is what happens when people have sex!  Damn people! : )

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Desertsp
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 9:50 am 
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@Stefan

That is EXACTLY the cause!

The US population has increased 1.6 times (192 to 326 million) since the Wilderness Act was signed. Meanwhile, did the amount of recreational land go up by even one acre?

https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.POP.TOTL?locations=US
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ahughjass
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 9:59 am 
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Schroder wrote:
All this will accomplish is dump more people on the trails just outside the Wilderness areas.  The quotas they set are arbitrary, subject to a few people's interpretation of requirements for solitude.

Well, you're not wrong.  Dog Mountain in the Columbia Gorge implemented an extra daily permit, on top of the NW Forrest Pass, for summer weekend hikes.    The overflowed parking at Dog Mountain completely disappeared.  But now, the Hamilton Mountain parking was overflowed.

Dog Mountain parking was an overflowing parking lot with an additional, and literal, one mile of cars parked along the highway.  After the new additional fee, the parking lot was about half to two-thirds full with zero cars parked along the highway.

After the added fee for Dog, Hamilton Mountain is overwhelmed on the weekends.  They said they had to change the policy for Dog because of the hazards of parking along Highway 14.  Well, all that happened was to shift the hazard from Dog to Hamilton.

Yeah, that worked well.

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ahughjass
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 10:14 am 
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Stefan wrote:
This is what happens when people have sex!  Damn people! : )

Overpopulation is one big contributing factor.  But the bigger recent factor is Instagram and social media.   

My wife and I lived literally next to Zion National Park for three years.   We left Zion and returned to the Seattle area in 2009 and visitors to Zion have increased by 150% since then.   I returned to Zion in Nov. last year.  Zion in November resembled "spring-break"  2009 when I lived there.  I couldn't believe it.  This increase comes from the Instagram-effect, IMHO.  (well, Instagram and other social media services).

To all you Instragram fans, I have to say, I think you'll get a better selfie if you get a little more close to the edge.  No, closer still.  C'mon a little closer... You want that great photo with the 'likes' don't you... well, be brave then, a little bit closer ...

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I go to the gym religiously.... Christmas and Easter

I love sports-bars.  Because they collect all the people I don't want to hang out with and put them in one room.
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thxII38
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 10:36 am 
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There's been "talk" about this for a couple of years now.   South Sister is my "Mailbox Peak" conditioning hike down here in Bend.  Some weeks I've done two or more climbs.  I do it in June as a snow climb (or ski).  In August as a trail run. 

I'm not happy about the changes.  That said, the SS climbers trail is extraordinarily overcrowded in the summer, and particularly on the weekends.
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Riverside Laker
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 10:56 am 
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We climbed Mt Whitney last week. There's no quota after Nov 1. Leaving on a Friday mid morning to get to the 4 mile camp at 10,500' (Outpost Camp), there were quite a few people we saw exiting after their climb. Most of them looked extremely bedraggled, barely able to shuffle to the trailhead, but luckily their last 4 miles are pretty easy trail. Just looooooong (as we discovered the next day). The vast majority of climbers were day-hiking the route, and there were dozens.

But Saturday, wow! What a zoo. We started at 4:30am and only saw about 10 people on the way up, but things changed later in the day. There were at least 60 people struggling up to the 6 mile camp at 12,000'! I'm not sure the Trailside Camp can accommodate all those folks. Many were going to get there well after dark. There were lots and lots of dayhikers also.

Of course, the two of us don't count in the numbers -- we are more special. Whitney is a very scenic and spectacular hike, with a unique geographical number of the highest point in 49 states. So no wonder it's popular. I can't imagine what it's like in warmer weather during peak season. 98% of the hikers were in their 20s and 30s, so we were outliers. Good thing there are quotas or it'll be like all the dang joggers thru-hiking the Enchantments. I'd post a selfie of us on the edge, but haven't loaded photos to a NWhikers-friendly location.
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reststep
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 11:36 am 
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I don't know. There were some large parties going to the mountains before social media.  These pictures are of a Mountaineers outing in 1919.


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DIYSteve
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 11:46 am 
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thxII38 wrote:
That said, the SS climbers trail is extraordinarily overcrowded in the summer, and particularly on the weekends.

Indeed, it is and it's not a new thing. 30 or so years ago I saw 100+ people walking up or down SS and est. 20 parties camping at or near Green Lake.
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RandyHiker
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PostFri Nov 16, 2018 12:11 pm 
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Mt Adams sometimes sees 250+ climbers a day.  That's one reason why the USFS implemented a "pack it all out" policy and includes a "blue bag kit" with its $15 "Cascade Volcano permit".

Parking and poop management-- probably will not what most people envisioned as their job when they applied to the USFS to become a ranger.
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Forum Index > Trail Talk > USFS to start requiring permits for 3 Oregon wildernesses in 2020
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