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kiliki
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PostFri Aug 30, 2019 12:54 pm 
Bedivere wrote:
Where are you guys getting these quotes from? I don't see any links to any articles about this, other than the blurb in the Times and from the Sheriff's dept. on Facebook that just says they were found. Lost a boot and his sleeping bag in a campfire accident? That sounds like Whisky fueled shenanigans to me.
in addition to the KIRO article there was also one on KOMO.

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MtnGoat
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PostFri Aug 30, 2019 1:09 pm 
my experience was pretty horrific, but it still beats being dead

Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
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Backpacker Joe
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PostFri Aug 30, 2019 7:59 pm 
From the article: Cabe said James lost a boot and his entire sleeping bag in a campfire accident, and then lost his knee brace. Look Im glad these guys are ok, but I really don't want to see them out in the mountains again!

"If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide." — Abraham Lincoln
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Brushwork
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PostFri Aug 30, 2019 9:12 pm 
Thank you Doppelgänger for the history/story. That’s fun to hear! It’s curious why the 2 guys would choose to go down via Sulphur ck... I think they were pretty lucky to have been found .

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Anne Elk
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PostFri Aug 30, 2019 10:39 pm 
Another up.gif to Doppelganger for the historical stories!
Belvidere wrote:
What were they thinking? Going down into Sulphur Creek isn't a shortcut, especially since there's no maintained trail there.
It also wasn't on the route plan they left with the family. Going off your itinerary under normal conditions is one thing, but doing it when you're already in trouble seems completely insane; further muddling the chance of being found. It's a wonder SAR found them as quickly as they did. One gets the impression that the last time "Buster" was on a multi-day backpack in the wilderness was his last trip to Cub Lake in the 60's. In re Kiliki's comment about giardia being "not that bad" - are there "degrees" of giardia infection ? I had it twice; once when it got into the municipal water supply of Banff and half the town got infected. Both times I was horribly ill - started with fever and chills, so you think at first that you have a very bad case of the flu. Fortunately my first infection was in a mt town where the MDs knew right away what was up. Some hikers get infected after they've returned home and the docs have no idea. I understand that if untreated, you can "recover" but it only means the parasite's gone dormant for a time and you will get recurring attacks later.

"There are yahoos out there. It’s why we can’t have nice things." - Tom Mahood
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Bedivere
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PostFri Aug 30, 2019 11:07 pm 
Anne Elk wrote:
Belvidere wrote:
What were they thinking? Going down into Sulphur Creek isn't a shortcut, especially since there's no maintained trail there.
It also wasn't on the route plan they left with the family. Going off your itinerary under normal conditions is one thing, but doing it when you're already in trouble seems completely insane;
It seemed to me that they weren't in trouble *until* they got down into Sulphur Creek and the terrain got too rough. That's just my interpretation, but it seems reasonable. They were probably fine up until they decided to go home via the "shortcut."
Backpacker Joe wrote:
From the article: Cabe said James lost a boot and his entire sleeping bag in a campfire accident, and then lost his knee brace. Look Im glad these guys are ok, but I really don't want to see them out in the mountains again!
lol.gif ykm.gif I'm with you. I mean, seriously, how do you lose a boot in a campfire accident? I can kind of almost understand the sleeping bag, given an experience we had once - A gust of wind blew a sleeping pad into the fire and it went up like a gasoline soaked bale of hay. We were all pretty shocked at how flammable a foam sleeping pad was and the owner had to sleep on the ground (his bag was fine, only his pad burned) for the rest of the trip. Maybe some sleeping bags are equally flammable? But a boot is a different thing. You'd have to toss your boot into the fire and let it sit there awhile before it became completely unusable...?

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Chief Joseph
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PostSat Aug 31, 2019 6:44 am 
I used to know a David James, lived up at Smokey Point...if it's the same one then I understand, lol.

Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof.
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Randito
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PostSat Aug 31, 2019 6:58 am 
Bedivere wrote:
I mean, seriously, how do you lose a boot in a campfire accident?
Seems understanderable to me, wet boots set next to a campfire to dry them out can easily be destroyed, particularly if someone falls asleep/passes out.

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gb
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PostSat Aug 31, 2019 8:23 am 
It's been interesting to read this thread to say the least. I was familiar with Cub Lake via Bachelor - back in 1972 that was a hike in 101 Hikes and we did it that year as a day trip. Since, I've been back three times. I also hiked the Sulphur Mountain trail one time and so I had assumed (before viewing a map) that Sulphur Creek was just a small stream coming somewhere down the flanks of Sulphur Mountain (which is quite steep). But no, I just reviewed a map out of curiosity and Sulphur Creek is a large tributary stream of the Suiattle that comes down a deep valley similar to Downey Creek. A quick map look makes this Sulphur Creek route look rather ridiculous. Miles of marshy alder and filled with avalanche paths from either side doubtless along the creek. I wonder if they even really looked at a map before coming up with this exit plan.

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joker
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PostSat Aug 31, 2019 9:25 am 
kiliki wrote:
Count me as another person that has had giardia ( probably from volunteering at the animal shelter, not drinking mountain water), and it's not THAT bad.
The effects are reputed to vary widely from person to person. In fact, as the CDC notes, in some cases, some people with giardia experience no symptoms (and thus may, for instance, have no problem despite drinking from every water source in the state etc etc). I've known a few people who would NOT say "it's not that bad..." about the experience. Some cases are pretty debilitating. That said, yeah sure, still better than going down from dehydration. I'll certainly prioritize avoiding bad dehydration should I ever find myself lost for days w/o water treatment capability.

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joker
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PostSat Aug 31, 2019 9:26 am 
RandyHiker wrote:
Seems understanderable to me, wet boots set next to a campfire to dry them out can easily be destroyed, particularly if someone falls asleep/passes out.
Yeah, Bevidere - you must not have ever been in a Boy Scout troop that often camped in the rain... I witnessed more than one pair of boots become useless, despite warnings from older kids who had seen it before.

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kbatku
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PostSat Aug 31, 2019 10:04 am 
I found a pair of burned boots by a campfire ring on the PCT between Stevens Pass and the White River back in 77 - I've often wondered what became of their owner

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neek
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PostSat Aug 31, 2019 10:29 am 
I'm starting to see how Burnt Boot Peak must have gotten its name!

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kiliki
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PostSat Aug 31, 2019 1:59 pm 
I suppose Giardia is like a lot of ailments in that severity of symptoms may vary. It's sure a good weight-loss plan although I was already a petite person. And I suppose it's relative. In recent years I've had major surgery, and also three eye surgeries after my retina detached. For Giardia I just took a pill! It took a while to fully recover, but give me that over a detached retina, or something where you have to wear a catheter, or where you can't tie your own shoes for a month, any day. Though I know some people have lasting issues after having Giardia and I don't mean to make light of that. The real point as many others have said is that you shouldn't be afraid to drink the water if the chips are down.

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joker
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PostSat Aug 31, 2019 2:40 pm 
Yes. There's almost always something worse than something else wink.gif And getting bad dehydration while lost is worse than having a risk of contracting giardia. No question. I once talked with the folks who run SAR out of Gunnison, CO, who see a LOT of fascinating year round action. Sounds like, in their opinion, hypothermia and dehydration were root causes of an awful lot of SAR issues regardless of what finally happened to the victims.

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