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WaState
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PostWed Jan 01, 2020 9:57 pm 
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Much of first aid can improvised with regular hiking gear. A pad and sticks for a splint. A cut up handkerchief or shirt for bandaging. I usually carry some electrolytes, a few tylenol sinus and ibuprofen and a few activated charcoal for stomach intestinal illness. Irigation of wounds (cleaning of wounds is very important to prevent infection) can be done with a water blader just pressurize it by pushing the bladder with hands and spray away. To stop major bleeding a bandage square and high force on the spot of the wound, very very high force for a cut artery will be needed with the patient screaming in pain., to save a life. Also a turnicut can be achieved with belts or straps or shirts.

Need for first aid is fairly rare except for foot blisters. The best blister treatment is to use duck tape on the blister. Make a small section that is smooth by taking a small square of duck tape and sticking on a larger piece of duck tape. Take this and stick on blister smoth section on top the blister. Custom bandaids are possible and duck tape also has gear repair potentual.

For summer to fall or spring  day hikes emergency gear can be less. A small day pack with a puffy jacket and If not that cold,  with a poncho  and a  light fire making kit can do very well.  SOL makes a good poncho for emergency usage. Any poncho that covers the whole body sitting can work.  The SOL emergency poncho can fit in a pants pocket, I have a mini bic lighter and two bits of fire starter in the same bag the SOL poncho is in, weight is about 3.5oz.   I see people on day hikes with nothing but a cell phone in the pocket. With good legs one can hike miles per hour, with a bad leg it can be hundreds of feet per hour.  Once you can't generate heat by moving can get very cold.
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Bronco
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PostThu Jan 02, 2020 9:15 am 
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Pahoehoe wrote:
I laughed at an outdoor activity group that wanted leaders to carry a syringe to flush wounds in a first aid kit for day trips not expected to last more than a few hours.

Sadly outdoor activity groups get sued for not having first aid gear and/or training as recommended by best practices.  A flushing syringe is recommended in the Wilderness First Responder curriculum.  Not a bad idea to flush any wound before bandaging.

I submit that an organized group leader has a little more responsibility than an individual day hiker.
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Chief Joseph
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PostThu Jan 02, 2020 9:52 am 
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I like to hike naked (not afraid) and just carry the "Bare Essentials"....like Wild Turkey, a Fire Starter, and a Water Filter, when it's cold I will hike with a large partner for warmth.  wink.gif

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Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof.
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Kim Brown
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PostThu Jan 02, 2020 10:19 am 
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Bronco wrote:
A flushing syringe is recommended in the Wilderness First Responder curriculum. Not a bad idea to flush any wound before bandaging.

I submit that an organized group leader has a little more responsibility than an individual day hiker.

Trail crew years ago got a giant wad of gritty mud in her eye. We would have had to call SAR to get her out if it weren't for the syringe the leader had.  Chances are high this won't happen to many hikers, but it certainly could (crawling under logs). A plastic syringe weighs practically nothing. We all tend to react to our own experiences. A plastic syringe seems useful to me because of the past experience. I'm kind've a freak about having a bright orange vest with me - seems dumb to someone else, but it's because of the woman who would have died her 4th (?) day being lost, if she hadn't happened to find a pair of bright yellow wading britches wrapped around some shrubbery; she used those to flag down the helo that had passed her by several times because they couldn't see her.

We all have our own deal.

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" I'm really happy about this! I have very strong good and horrible memories up there."  oldgranola, NWHs outdoors advocate.
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Ski
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PostThu Jan 02, 2020 11:37 am 
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^ yeah... I can see where that syringe would have helped when I fell down and punctured my leg on a pointy stick. hurt like hell.
hobbled down to the river and waded in thigh-deep and washed it out but it still had a mess of crap in it. syringe thingie would have done it much better and it might not have gotten all festered up like it did.

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Malachai Constant
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PostThu Jan 02, 2020 12:02 pm 
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Sawyer water filters come with a plastic syringe.

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"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn
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Anne Elk
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PostThu Jan 02, 2020 1:52 pm 
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brushwork wrote:
Cyclopath wrote:
I got the campfire app for $3.  It keeps you warm at night and you can use it to make s'mores.

Maybe I need to get that campfire app.... I am waiting for the Sherpa app - to help with my overnight gear.   There needs to be a sunshine app,   And a few others...

Michael Leunig_Pants on Fire
Michael Leunig_Pants on Fire

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Cyclopath
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PostThu Jan 02, 2020 2:11 pm 
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You only need that app if you lie all the time.
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RumiDude
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PostThu Jan 02, 2020 2:11 pm 
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Bronco wrote:
Pahoehoe wrote:
I laughed at an outdoor activity group that wanted leaders to carry a syringe to flush wounds in a first aid kit for day trips not expected to last more than a few hours.

Sadly outdoor activity groups get sued for not having first aid gear and/or training as recommended by best practices.  A flushing syringe is recommended in the Wilderness First Responder curriculum.  Not a bad idea to flush any wound before bandaging.
I submit that an organized group leader has a little more responsibility than an individual day hiker.

Well the contents of a FAK for an individual vs a group are obviously going to be much different. And the contents of a group's FAK would vary according to the group itself. If it is a meet-up group, likely everyone is responsible for themselves. If it is an organizational group there may be insurance requirements as well as requirements from the group's association memberships.

When I led teen groups for week long trips in the Cascades, we had an RN or EMT travel with us with a full EMT FAK which included things like epipens and such. When I am out with WTA groups, there is always an WFA certified individual (usually more) with a big FAK which probably contains a syringe or two.

When my boys were young I took a more extensive FAK than I do now when I mostly hike solo. When I am on extended trips I usually throw in a few more items.

Something to consider, especially on extended trips are injuries/sickness that are not life threatening or crippling yet would necessitate cutting short a trip to deal with if you didn't have the proper supplies to deal with it. So yea you might use a piece of clothing as an emergency bandage, but that would not likely be sufficient for very long. Also some trips cannot be cut short easily. For instance, I did a nine day trip in the Grand Canyon last March/April. Once in for longer than a couple days I was pretty much committed to the full trip because there weren't any bailout options.

I have a FAK I have made up. It gets thrown in my pack whether it's a day hike or a week long trip. I don't have to have multiple FAKs or have to reinvent the wheel, customizing my FAK for each trip. I usually go through the kit once or twice a year to make sure everything is up to date and replace what is needed.

Rumi

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Pahoehoe
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PostThu Jan 02, 2020 10:22 pm 
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Bronco wrote:
Sadly outdoor activity groups get sued for not having first aid gear and/or training as recommended by best practices. A flushing syringe is recommended in the Wilderness First Responder curriculum. Not a bad idea to flush any wound before bandaging.

I submit that an organized group leader has a little more responsibility than an individual day hiker.

I'm talking about outings lasting just a couple hours.  Like, if someone is hurt, we are turning around.  I get why you would want the ability to clean and dress serious wounds on a longer trip, but it doesnt make much sense when you aren't far from doctor/hospital/urgent care if needed, and clean running water...

Plus, probably over 50% of people use hydration bladders which can do the same thing as a syringe.  So can some water bottles.  You could also cut the corner off a ziplock bag and make a good stream of water...

Everything, not matter how small and light is taking space and energy that could be used for something else...
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Downhill
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PostFri Jan 03, 2020 6:22 pm 
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Plenty of ironies here to kick around.

>99% of the people reading this thread know not only what to bring, but how to avoid getting in trouble in the first place (of course accidents still do happen to experienced, knowledgable outdoors people).

The vast majority of problems occur, not just to the unprepared, but those lacking the knowledge and experience to understand the risks or even realize they are putting themselves at risk at all.

I guess I'm just getting too cynical in my old age but there's an overabundance of safety information available today, much more so than past decades but there's never a shortage of people heading in the mountains who are dangerously ill-prepared.

Maybe it's the availability of "information" that is contributing to the problem.  People see beautiful photos of "________ Lake" on Instaspam and expect hiking there is as easy as clicking on the photo.  I don't like adding myself to the "blame-social-media" squad but I do think there is at least some valid attribution.
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Pahoehoe
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PostFri Jan 03, 2020 6:24 pm 
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Sometimes, but I dont think you can fault someone for taking a bad step and twisting an ankle or something.
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WaState
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PostMon Jan 13, 2020 10:56 am 
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If a person tends to twist ankles there some things to do to help prevent or mitigate. First thing is to take short steps especially down hill. Most times twisted ankles happen when stepping downhill. Little short steps greatly reduce the chance of a twisted ankle and knee injury. Also trekking poles help support ankles , knees , back etc. Stepping down with a slightly bent knee also can help. Stepping down with the toe of the boot slightly pointed outward  can also help.  Dont every go into mental zombie mode, which often happens after a long day heading down after a hike. Mentally force the shorter steps, toes outward, bent knee, using trekking poles.  On flat ground or uphill can safely stretch out step length.

Even with weak knees or ankles with care one can prevent injury. Doing such tricks does not slow you down  much.

If needed get more sturdy footwear, wide low footwear may be best with ankle support.

Lastly carry duck tape and or a ace bandage, both can be used to wrap up the ankle to keep moving.

If you twist the ankle once , slow down , concentrate on short steps,  toes pointed out some, maybe wrap the ankle. This to prevent the next ankle twist that may stop you.

If the above is done by everyone with weak ankles, SAR call outs likely to be reduced quite a bit.

Those who read this can pass the information on.

I am just guy who has had twisted ankles so by neciessty figured out what to do about it. With shorter steps downhill and not going into mental zombie mode. I very rarely twist the ankle these days and if so it is not that bad of twist.
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Pahoehoe
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PostMon Jan 13, 2020 11:13 am 
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Wow.  Just wow.
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WaState
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PostMon Jan 13, 2020 11:18 am 
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I l sometimes like singing , walk like a duck steps short and toes wide , quack , quack , quack.  wink.gif

This also works uphill in snow.
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