Forum Index > Public Lands Stewardship > Federal Prosecution for hitting a bird with your car?
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Tom
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PostFri Feb 07, 2020 5:37 pm 
catsp, I don't believe anyone has called you a troll.

Ultimately it will be decided by the courts.

I'll go ahead and move this to stewardship.

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MtnGoat
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PostFri Feb 07, 2020 5:53 pm 
Slugman wrote:
Holy cow, you write a lot to say nothing, or at least nothing that makes sense. Look at this utter nonsense you wrote: “Some people are apparently okay with an incredibly over broad (interpretation of) law that criminalizes their own behavior because they're confident they won't actually be prosecuted.”  This is false, as had been pointed out to you repeatedly. .

It was claimed to be false, it was never actually shown to be false." Pointing out" what is not actually shown, doesn't count.

This is similar to the fake debunkings which aren't, since they never actually falsify the contentions they claim to be debunking.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
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MtnGoat
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PostFri Feb 07, 2020 5:53 pm 
Tom wrote:
catsp, I don't believe anyone has called you a troll.

Ultimately it will be decided by the courts.

I'll go ahead and move this to stewardship.

I was going to put it here in the first place, but then since it was not lands related I did not.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
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Tom
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PostFri Feb 07, 2020 7:00 pm 
MG, with the "What does it mean for you and I" nonsense of the opinion piece which only serves to obfuscate I am not surprised it didn't strike you as fitting within the parameters of stewardship.  If you want to foster genuine discussion why not lead with a more balanced article?  I found this to be a good read:

https://aldf.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/Taking-A-Peck-Out-of-Protection.pdf

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Sculpin
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PostSat Feb 08, 2020 8:40 am 
MtnGoat wrote:
I was going to put it here in the first place, but then since it was not lands related I did not.

That is the logical part of your brain, doing its business.  Keep working on it, you will figure it out.   wink.gif

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Between every two pines is a doorway to the new world. - John Muir
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MtnGoat
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PostSat Feb 08, 2020 11:44 am 
Tom wrote:
MG, with the "What does it mean for you and I" nonsense of the opinion piece which only serves to obfuscate I am not surprised it didn't strike you as fitting within the parameters of stewardship.  If you want to foster genuine discussion why not lead with a more balanced article?  I found this to be a good read:

https://aldf.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/Taking-A-Peck-Out-of-Protection.pdf

You made it very clear you wanted apolitical lands only stuff here following the conniptions over Voldemort, or that was my take anyway. You even specifically added lands to the title. So OK, whatever is related to stewardship and is not just lands I will now post in this forum.

It's interesting that you gripe about what you imply is not neutral, then present an advocacy piece you claim will 'foster' conversation most likely because you agree with it's premises.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
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Tom
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Tom
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PostSat Feb 08, 2020 1:37 pm 
If it's politics with a tie in to public lands it goes here.  Otherwise if it's politics it doesn't go anywhere.  Not that hard.

Sorry you didn't like that read.  What issues do you have with it?  Factual inaccuracies?  What is the premise and what do you disagree with?  I didn't say it was neutral but would certainly say it's more balanced than the "apolitical" piece you thought was appropriate for the saloon.  uhh.gif

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catsp
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PostTue Mar 09, 2021 5:17 pm 
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Brian R
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PostTue Mar 09, 2021 11:34 pm 
MtnGoat wrote:
It's interesting that you gripe about what you imply is not neutral, then present an advocacy piece you claim will 'foster' conversation most likely because you agree with it's premises.

lol.gif  lol.gif  lol.gif  lol.gif
Perfect, MtG.

Fostering. Community. Neutral is where he lives it. And the rest of the universe is simply other.

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Sculpin
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PostWed Mar 10, 2021 8:22 am 
Brian R wrote:
Perfect, MtG.

Mtn. Goat seems to have hit 12000 posts and decided to find another hobby.  He has not posted since May 2020.

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Between every two pines is a doorway to the new world. - John Muir
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trestle
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PostThu Mar 11, 2021 4:28 pm 
Sculpin wrote:
and decided to find another hobby.  He has not posted since May 2020.

One can only spin so many circles, after all.

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"Life favors the prepared." - Edna Mode
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Cyclopath
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PostSun Mar 14, 2021 10:59 pm 
catsp wrote:
Biden Moves To Make It Illegal (Again) To Accidentally Kill Migratory Birds

From your link:

The law was key in 2010, when the BP oil spill — an accident — was believed to have killed hundreds of thousands of birds in the Gulf Coast. BP was fined $100 million under the Migratory Bird Treaty Act.

Too bad people react to stuff like this in such an emotional and knee jerk manner.

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catsp
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PostTue Mar 16, 2021 4:39 pm 
Cyclopath wrote:
Too bad people react to stuff like this in such an emotional and knee jerk manner.

Not quite sure who you are directing this comment at, but funnily enough I agree. I recall being on the receiving end of a fair amount of mockery and disdain for expressing the opinion that a law so broadly written was not a good thing, mostly from those individuals who were unable to separate that opinion from any individual concern with actually being targeted for prosecution under the MBTA for accidentally "taking" black-crowned night herons who fell from the tree that I trimmed because they were pooping all over my windshield.

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Randito
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PostTue Mar 16, 2021 4:57 pm 
The link in the OP tries to spread FUD that the MBTA of 1918 will be used to prosecute indivuduals for unintentional, accidental and incidental deaths of birds without providing even a single example of such a prosecution.

Seems like a standard propaganda technique of the "Government is the problem" crowd.

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catsp
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catsp
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PostTue Mar 16, 2021 5:47 pm 
Randito wrote:
The link in the OP tries to spread FUD that the MBTA of 1918 will be used to prosecute indivuduals for unintentional, accidental and incidental deaths of birds without providing even a single example of such a prosecution.

Seems like a standard propaganda technique of the "Government is the problem" crowd.

I'm going to say that I expect that you didn't actually read the article OP linked. And I expect you might tell me you did. And I expect that I might not believe you. wink.gif  For those that actually read the article, it clearly has a lot of facts correct. Like, indisputably so. (Yes, the bird initially used is not actually covered by the MBTA, but not only was that acknowledged, it's a minor point to begin with if we are going to be even mildly honest brokers here.) But I imagine many people simply considered the presumed (and maybe actual?) intent of the OP, as well as the source itself, and didn't worry too much about facts after that.

I'm not defending or otherwise concerned with the intent of the OP, or the wattsup website. But just on a lark, read the article. Try to ignore some of the unnecessary hyperbole and see if you really disagree with the main substance.

The MBTA is so overbroad that it really does criminalize much of the routine stuff this thread discussed earlier. It has onerous potential penalties, and as a result it was routinely used to harass and threaten. On top of that, it' has been very selectively applied.

First they came for those with mud and wastewater reserve pits, and I did not speak out...

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