[Brushbuffalo]

Question, my fellow explorers: I am seeking information about Trail 471, a branch that some old maps show. This trail intersection is obvious at about 5960' where it leads north from the trail leading to Fred's Lake, Lake Doris, and Shellrock Pass, which most people use for access to Osceola, Carru, Lago, etc. As I recall it is signed as 'abandoned,' (or is it 'not maintained' ?) as one hikes up to Fred's Lake On Dick Pargeter's wonderful pictorial map The North Cascades, East trail 471 contours north to Bark Creek and further to Pleasant Valley Creek, then ascends to the ridge between Lease Creek and Middle Fork Pasayten River, then to Point Defiance before descending through a large burn to 3 Forks on the Pasayten. Trail 471 is visible on Google Earth south of Pleasant Valley but I can't see remnants north of there until near the site of a former lookout at Point Defiance, the lookout foundation being clearly visible as a square, obviously manmade ( ok, human made). Have any of you used this trail 471?

[Randito]

Have you tried calling the Methow Ranger district ? 24 West Chewuch Road Winthrop, WA 98862 Phone: 509-996-4000 Voice

[Brushbuffalo]

Good idea, Randito. I know the former district ranger, who had a goal of hiking every trail in the Methow district. Perhaps he can give me some beta.

[borank]

We were up that way a few years back. Trail was pretty straight forward getting to Pleasant Lk. We were heading for the lakes on the E side of the ridge, so didn't spend any time looking for the trail going north from the lake, but just angled up the hill to the ridgetop. You can pretty much walk wherever you want up there. The little valley above the lake heading toward Osceola Pk is a nice side trip.

[gray matter]

I’ve been out to that area twice, and honestly don’t recall ever seeing a trail sign coming off of the trail that leads to Fred’s lake. That trail would put you onto the ridge north of Osceola, correct? Based on our experience with other non-maintained trails in that area (specifically north of Shellrock Pass), I’d be hesitant to count on any maintenance. I’m due one more trip into that area this summer.

[Bedivere]

There is a sign at the trail junction on the way up to Fred's lake. It reads "Point Defiance.". I have a picture of it from one of my trips up there. This map shows the old trail. Since I've never tried to follow it, can't say much more about it.

[Brushbuffalo]

Thanks for the old map, Bedivere. I will probably head east from the lake in Pleasant Valley to hit the ridge and follow it to Pt. Defiance. If the trai is shown accurately, it was built before switchbacks were 'invented.' I remember seeing the sign before Fred's Lake but certainly don't expect any maintenance. I know that the forest around the trail north from the former lookout site down to Three Forks has been burned and would feature hundreds of downed trees....not going thataway!

[Luc]

I recall seeing the Pt Defiance burn area from Ptarmigan/Tatoosh area. It looked gnar. But if you've been through burns you know what to expect. What is your plan if you don't go N? I've thought it would be spooky and fun to hit Lease. Looks like there's water options on the E side of that Pt Defiance ridge, south of it, as mentioned above. I wonder if anyone has hopped over from the Defiance area S/SE to the Lease "trail". Personally, I find abandon trails a completely different, challenging, and cool experience. Getting me thinking about an attempt this summer, too.

[borank]

We dropped off Ptarmigan down to the Lease trail way back in '91, before any of the recent big burns, and the trail up to the lake was pretty sketchy even then. Once you arrive at the lake it becomes clearer why the trail was abandoned.

[Brushbuffalo]

[Brushbuffalo]

I hiked Trail 471 on September 28 with the intent of getting to the former lookout site at Pt. Defiance.The sign where 471 departs from the Shellrock Pass Trail says 'Trail Abandoned' but actually it is in decent shape. The worst part was in the first quarter mile near Berk Creek, where there were half a dozen big trees down. But all that easy travel ended shortly past the lake at Pleasant Valley. As borank wrote earlier in this thread: " Once you arrive at the lake it becomes clearer why the trail was abandoned." Spoiler alert: a jackstraw of downed trees. I followed a faint path downhill, in accordance with the mapped trail, from the lake for several hundred yards but lost it in a maze of windfall. I fumbled around on a steep forested hillside, with the view of the intended ridge occasionally visible through the trees, but in the waning light I 'called it' and retreated to the rocks of the shore of the lake in order make dinner to leave any tantalizing food odors to confuse the bears (which bears had deposited abundant scat, some very fresh), then hiked a quarter mile away to bivy. I had to be home today so couldn't explore any more. I might have resumed by not trying find and follow the obliterated trail shown on old maps north of the lake, but instead go directly northeast up to the ridge crest. I don't relish hiking all that way again but if I go back to bag the lookout site I will try a route that goes directly up and down from the main Middle Fork Pasayten trail from the west of Pt. Defiance.