Forum Index > Trail Talk > All National Forest Trails in Washington & Oregon are Closed
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Stephen B
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Stephen B
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 3:49 pm 
Brushwork wrote:
Kim Brown wrote:
OK, I'm a happy camper (pardon the pun). Not crazy! Ain't nobody ever said that about me. wub.gif
Kim, Is that what it takes to be a happy camper? Because I’m pretty sure I’m crazy, certainly more and more these days and I am NOT a happy camper. Depriving me of my ability to get out and actually camp just has pulled the rug out from my happy camping days...
Isolation is not good for human beings in general. For those struggling with anxiety, depression, drug or alcohol dependency, etc, it can be a killer. People who throw blanket aspersions on people for being "assholes" or "selfish" for wanting to get out should consider that for many getting out is a requirement for physical and mental health.

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Randito
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 3:57 pm 
Kim Brown wrote:
I don't have access to WaPo. Does the article indicate they were doing something stupid, or just that they caught the virus while working together?
WP wrote:
By Darryl Fears, Juliet Eilperin and Dino Grandoni March 31, 2020 at 1:35 p.m. PDT PLEASE NOTE The Washington Post is providing this story for free so that all readers have access to this important information about the coronavirus. For more free stories, sign up for our daily Coronavirus Updates newsletter. At least seven National Park Service employees have tested positive for the novel coronavirus, yet the Trump administration continues to operate the park system that attracts thousands of Americans each day. In response to questions from The Washington Post, the agency said Tuesday that as of Monday, seven Park Service employees have tested positive for covid-19, the disease caused by the virus. That figure doesn’t include workers in the park who are not federal employees. “The NPS is working with our contractors and concessionaires to track reported cases of their employees as well,” Stephanie Roulett, a spokeswoman, wrote in an email. The Park Service, a division of the Interior Department, will not identify where the affected employees are to protect their identities The infections came to light in a Wednesday teleconference when Park Service Director David Vela told workers, “this week, sadly, we received word of the first confirmed cases of NPS employees with covid-19.” Last week, the superintendent of Great Smoky Mountains National Park, which straddles the border between Tennessee and North Carolina, said an employee tested positive. It was closed March 24. At Grand Canyon National Park, which drew large crowds over the weekend and remains open, park employees were informed Monday that a resident in the park’s housing complex on the South Rim has tested positive. Roulett said no Park Service employee at Grand Canyon has been diagnosed with covid-19. Officials in Coconino County, which includes the park, have asked it to be shut down. Covid-19 is a highly infectious disease. “Whenever you see the virus, it’s moved on already — it will have infected other people by the time you become aware of it,” said Bill Hanage, an epidemiologist at the Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health. Sign up for our Coronavirus Updates newsletter to track the outbreak. All stories linked in the newsletter are free to access. The Park Service has closed more than 100 sites to protect against spreading the coronavirus, including some of its most popular landmarks — the Golden Gate National Recreation Area, the Statue of Liberty and the Arches and Yellowstone national parks. But more than 300 sites remain open, and the government has waived entrance fees. News that the virus is spreading through national parks staffs has sparked complaints from employees who are still compelled to go to work. On Monday, Interior Secretary David Bernhardt sent a note to department employees reiterating the importance of keeping operations going despite the pandemic. “Your continued perseverance to continue the work at hand is recognized and appreciated,” Bernhardt wrote in the opening paragraph. He pressed employees to continue working. “I appreciate and expect that all department employees will continue to fulfill their duties and responsibilities as assigned while also taking necessary steps to preserve their health and safety and attend to the needs of their families,” he wrote. These 'mission critical' federal employees are still reporting to the office. And they're terrified they'll get sick But many rank-and-file employees are afraid of transferring the illness to family members, said Dustin Stone, a Park Service worker in Alaska who quit about two weeks ago over Bernhardt’s refusal to close the parks. Like some park superintendents and leaders in neighboring communities, Stone is pressing to close parks during the outbreak. A photo shared on Twitter by Zion National Park shows groups of hikers on a trail at Angels Landing on March 21. The National Park Service warned against hiking in groups at a time when social distancing is favored to slow the spread of the coronavirus. (National Park Service) A photo shared on Twitter by Zion National Park shows groups of hikers on a trail at Angels Landing on March 21. The National Park Service warned against hiking in groups at a time when social distancing is favored to slow the spread of the coronavirus. (National Park Service warned against hiking in groups at a time when social distancing is favored to slow the spread of the coronavirus. National Park Service) Sen. Joe Manchin III (W.Va.), the ranking Democrat on the Senate Energy and Natural Resources Committee, along with a group of 10 House Democrats led by House Natural Resources Chairman Raul Grijalva (Ariz.), urged Bernhardt in a pair of letters Tuesday to close off more sites to help stop the spread of the virus. The Park Service said it can operate its attractions in a way that is consistent with public health advisories. “We have issued messages on park websites, social media, and in the press to urge our visitors to follow CDC [Centers for Disease Control and Prevention] guidance, and provided additional measures for the public to follow if they choose to visit our parks,” Roulett said. The agency has limited the public’s access to narrow trails, park grounds and popular overlooks to adhere to the CDC’s guidance on social distancing. “The health and safety of National Park Service visitors, employees, volunteers, and partners is our number one priority,” said the spokeswoman. But many of the restrictions were implemented after visitors crowded onto paths, camps and overlooks, potentially spreading the virus. The alerts do not inform visitors that some staffers have been infected. The Park Service said there was little chance that those who tested positive could have spread the virus to a visitor. In the weeks leading to the infections of workers, according to several park staffers, top officials appeared to minimize the impact of the outbreak. The agency’s Region 1 website posted a “Tricky Tuesday” entry on March 3 that said the CDC considered the virus “a serious public health threat; however, based on current information, the immediate health risk within the U.S. is considered low at this time. While instances of person-to-person spread between close contacts has been detected in the U.S., this virus is NOT currently spreading throughout U.S. communities.” About a week later, Interior delivered “talking points” to employees that praised President Trump’s handling of the crisis. The document, obtained by The Post, noted that Trump had “Suspended all travel coming in from China and Iran” and “delivered a historically strong economy, whether it’s on unemployment numbers or on productivity and he’s going to keep doing that.” Before last week, Stone in Alaska was the only Park Service employee to speak out against Bernhardt’s decision to keep the parks open. After Vela told thousands of employees on the Wednesday conference call that multiple colleagues had the coronavirus and implored them to keep working, that changed. Trevor Wright was one of several workers at the Lyndon B. Johnson National Historical Park sent home Thursday over concerns about exposure to the virus. Wright, who has done masonry, carpentry and other maintenance work at the park for five years, asked his supervisors why some parks were open during the pandemic. When he didn’t get an answer that satisfied him, Wright sent a letter to his park’s superintendent asking for an explanation. Wright began to email park employees when he failed to get a response — first everyone at his park, then everyone in a region stretching from Montana to Texas. Finally, he emailed nearly every park employee across the country. “I was so very tired of hearing non-answer answers as to why we were doing this,” Wright said in an interview. “No one could tell me why the risk was acceptable or what the perceived benefit was.” A Park Service official said Monday that there are no confirmed cases of agency employees with covid-19 at Lyndon B. Johnson National Historical Park. As Wright questioned his supervisors in Texas, Great Smoky Mountains National Park closed. At first, the Park Service told media outlets that an employee had tested positive. But by the end of the week, the agency sent a memo to superintendents and public affairs officers instructing them to no longer publicly confirm covid-19 cases in specific parks to “ensure employee privacy.” Kristen Brengel, vice president of government affairs for the National Parks Conservation Association, said the agency should be able to offer more information to park employees and visitors when an infection is confirmed. “It’s really important for people to have this information,” she said.

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Kim Brown
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 4:06 pm 
Oy vey.

"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area." Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
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MtnGoat
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 4:09 pm 
Kim Brown wrote:
To me, it's only March, and I wouldn't be considering camping until June or July anyway. I was hoping for a road trip in late April or sometime in May - that could happen still....but if not, then I'll wait.
Only March? That's when everything on the dryside turns green, we get an hour of daylight back in the evening... and camping season begins!

Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
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Cyclopath
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 4:33 pm 
Anne Elk wrote:
One thing that's probably safe to assume is that we're going to see a lot more TP blooms in the woods once this is over. rolleyes.gif
Ha ha, if only people could get TP!

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Cyclopath
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 4:33 pm 
altasnob wrote:
Per Cyclopath's suggestions, the thousands of people who normally hike Mt Si, Mailbox, Rattlesnake, ect. shouldn't be hanging out at their house, and recreating close to their homes, but instead should still be driving to these trailheads, parking a couple hundred feet behind the closed trail heads, and continuing to hike like nothing has changed (just make sure to drink your coffee and crap at home because the pit toilet is closed).
I didn't say say like nothing has changed. I'm only filling my tank with gloves and mask, I'm not stopping for espresso or food, etc. I'm saying don't go to places you know will be crowded, don't even use trails, bushwack from pullouts ideally with room for only one car. I've also been saying lower your standards in terms of destination, don't go for desirable hikes that will attract other people. Just like I didn't say you should crap in the woods. Apparently it's impossible to say people shouldn't hike without using strawmen. That should tell you something.

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Stephen B
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 4:38 pm 
Cyclopath wrote:
Apparently it's impossible to say people shouldn't hike without using strawmen. That should tell you something.
lol.gif

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Cyclopath
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 4:38 pm 
altasnob wrote:
I'm not trying to pick fights. If someone wants to drive to an obscure trail head and go hiking right now, go right ahead. Doesn't bother me. What bother's me is posting the idea on the internet for the thousands to follow. I assume all of trails accessed by the closed trailhead notice are still very busy. No need to encourage more use, particularly with the bathrooms shut down. I also take exception with Cyclopath's claim that mountains are safer for people to be in rather than stick to their neighborhoods. That may be true if just a few venture up to the mountains to recreate (which again, I have no problem with). But if everyone heads Cyclopath's advice, the mountains WILL NOT be safer. So if you want to hike, go for it, but just don't brag about it online.
There are about 12 people reading this thread, you don't have to worry about the unwashed masses all hiking in different places because of something I posted on page 6 of a wonky policy thread. Our governor is saying you can still drive to hike. With an audience, no less! Please let's not act like I'm some kind of monster here. I hope it calms your nerves to know that most people won't make the smart choice in this, like with most things. Most people can't even be bothered to claim rebates, let alone do which research to figure out where they can drive an hour to walk in the dirt. Hiking just isn't that important to most people. Most people aren't willing to direct the gas money now that we're in a recession. Most people just think it's closed. This really isn't worth worrying about, I promise. I realize everybody is on edge right now, for good reason. Maybe a day trip into the mountains will help you feel better.

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Ski
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 4:39 pm 
Bernhardt's refusal to close all NPS facilities is criminal negligence. Both of you just got copies of the emails I sent. For the rest of you: David Vela, Acting Director, National Park Service: david_vela@nps.gov Hilary Franz, Director, Department of Natural Resources: cpl@dnr.wa.gov Kelly Susewind, Director, Washington State Department of Fish and Wildlife: director@dfw.wa.gov If either of you have contact information for USFS let me know. Thanks. BK == Thanks for posting the entire article, Randy. == How many entries does the "ignore list" hold?

"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach. I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
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Routes
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 5:35 pm 
uww wrote:
This is all about people doing their part for the greater good. Sure, I could buy that discount ticket to Hawaii and have a grand time next week and odds are pretty good I won't be the one who catches/spreads anything or ends up in the hospital. But somebody will. I'll stay at home and limit my trips to the grocery store and walks around my neighborhood because I'm not the kind of person who thinks I am more important or luckier than anyone else.
up.gif up.gif up.gif

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Kim Brown
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 8:42 pm 
MtnGoat wrote:
Only March? That's when everything on the dryside turns green, we get an hour of daylight back in the evening... and camping season begins!
I like road trips, dayhikes, moteling, and small town restaurants in spring! The coast, Republic, and your neck of the woods. But I can't get out til after April 15.

"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area." Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
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PostTue Mar 31, 2020 8:51 pm 
Get me up on them trails!!! Up on them ridgelines!!!!!

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MtnGoat
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PostWed Apr 01, 2020 8:27 am 
Cyclopath wrote:
I hope it calms your nerves to know that most people won't make the smart choice in this, like with most things. Most people can't even be bothered to claim rebates, let alone do which research to figure out where they can drive an hour to walk in the dirt. Hiking just isn't that important to most people. Most people aren't willing to direct the gas money now that we're in a recession. Most people just think it's closed. This really isn't worth worrying about, I promise. I realize everybody is on edge right now, for good reason. Maybe a day trip into the mountains will help you feel bette
up.gif

Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock. - Will Rogers
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PostWed Apr 01, 2020 8:41 am 
National Forest trailheads close after ‘stay-at-home’ prompts rush to the outdoors in Crosscut. Not really adding anything that hasn't already been said, but a fresh article on this subject.

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PostWed Apr 01, 2020 2:32 pm 
re: Crosscut article cited just above by altasnob:
Mandy Godwin, writing for Crosscut wrote:
Law enforcement officers have the authority to give citations or even arrest those who don’t follow the order, but officials hope that Pacific Northwesterners will stay home of their own accord.
Who did not see this coming? The more pressure that is put on the trails, the more restrictive will be the response from lands management agencies. Unfortunately it appears that the simple directive to "stay home" is too complicated for some to be able to understand.

"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach. I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
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