Forum Index > Trail Talk > Now That's What I Call Another Forest Closure Question Volume #376257
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catfish206
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PostMon May 18, 2020 5:44 pm 
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Apologies if this is redundant, first pandemic over here. I was out by the Taylor River TH the other day and saw this sign. Can anyone share any clarity about what exactly is meant by "area that has been improved or developed for recreation"? Are we talking picnic tables and fire rings, dispersed roadside camping, backcountry sites or all of the above?


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moonspots
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PostMon May 18, 2020 6:15 pm 
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catfish206 wrote:
Apologies if this is redundant, first pandemic over here. I was out by the Taylor River TH the other day and saw this sign. Can anyone share any clarity about what exactly is meant by "area that has been improved or developed for recreation"? Are we talking picnic tables and fire rings, dispersed roadside camping, backcountry sites or all of the above?


I don't know, but it certainly appears that this whole so-called safety "Back Story" is certainly being carried too far by administrators who are afraid of their own shadow. Now perhaps the forests in the PNW are far more dangerous than the midwest prairies, but seriously, I don't see any science behind this.

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jinx'sboy
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PostMon May 18, 2020 6:26 pm 
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“Developed Sites” have a specific meaning in USFS-speak.  And the types of closure Orders - like this one - are different when used to close developed sites, or trails/roads, or general bits of the Forest.

This is a Region-wide closure of FS sites in Forests in OR and WA.  It is specific to Developed sites, and does NOT include closure of roads, trails or dispersed (general) areas or Wilderness.

‘Developed sites’ generally have lots of “stuff”; on-site hardening, signs, pavement, structures, etc.  They would include ALL campgrounds, picnic areas, boat launches, visitor centers and resorts (including ski areas), and SOME trailheads.

If a trailhead has a toilet, hitch rail, loading ramp, lots of signs, kiosks, etc....then, yes, it is a “developed” site” and is closed.  If the trail head is a wide spot - and 4 cars can park off the road and there is a small wooden site that says ‘Deer Lake - 5 miles’ - that ISNT a developed site, and is open.

Hope that helps.

(I think what the FS did with their closure is try to align itself with the States’ closure orders, while allowing some access to the Forest.)
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treeswarper
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PostMon May 18, 2020 6:27 pm 
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It mentions that you should refer to a recreation map, and I'll bet that that is part of the closing of trailheads that went on to keep folks from gathering at the trailheads.

Developments would be picnic tables, outhouses, docks, etc.

It doesn't mean the whole forest is closed down by any means.

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Brushwork
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PostMon May 18, 2020 7:34 pm 
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I’m pretty sure the developed “site” is the picnic areas that were recently spruced up and were created in part to stop the over night camping in that area.  (Obviously some are still camping there as evidenced by fire rings). With the recent Covid closure, this picnic area is currently closed, though the trail is not.   Closure or not, overnight camping is no longer allowed there.

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SwitchbackFisher
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PostMon May 18, 2020 10:55 pm 
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Basically if in summer the USFS charges a fee to use it, day use NW Forest pass, camping America the beautiful, It's closed. As mentioned above TH with no amenities and no parking fee good to go.

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mosey
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PostTue May 19, 2020 1:04 pm 
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With specific regards to this area, I've been assuming since roads are open, and the "trailhead" is in the middle of the road, it is ok to continue through.

The trailhead at the end of that road is not developed either, but has a sign saying developed sites are closed, so it's a bit confusing. There are pullouts nearby though.
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JPH
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PostTue May 19, 2020 2:44 pm 
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mosey wrote:
The trailhead at the end of that road is not developed either, but has a sign saying developed sites are closed, so it's a bit confusing. There are pullouts nearby though.

Doesn't Dingford have a toilet?
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zephyr
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PostTue May 19, 2020 3:42 pm 
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JPH wrote:
Doesn't Dingford have a toilet?

Yes, but the O.P. was referring to Taylor River TH.  Dingford has a toilet.  I was up that way 12 days ago.  I didn't check to see if it was unlocked or not.  There is also a picnic table at Dingford Creek TH.  I did see where a tree had fallen onto the roof and knocked a hole into the vestibule cover.  The tree had been removed and there were a number of trees along that road that had been cleared.  ~z
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Kim Brown
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PostTue May 19, 2020 4:35 pm 
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Is this sign different from all the others we've hashed around ad nauseum the last couple of months?

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jinx'sboy
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PostTue May 19, 2020 4:36 pm 
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Sounds like SOME of the trailheads and day use areas on the Okanogan - Wenatchee NF will open May 22.  SOME campgrounds will open in June.  All facilities may or may-not be available at these open sites.

I saw this on a Facebook post from the Forest.  I didn’t know whether or not other Washington Forests (or Oregon) Are doing something similar.  I would hope there is some co-ordination.

News release, today, from the OKA-WEN NF:  https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/okawen/news-events/?cid=FSEPRD742926
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JPH
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PostTue May 19, 2020 5:47 pm 
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zephyr wrote:
Yes, but the O.P. was referring to Taylor River TH.

The Taylor River TH and the picnic area are essentially one and the same now since the road is permanently blocked in that spot, so parking, picnic tables & toilet.

How's the road up to Dingford?
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zephyr
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PostTue May 19, 2020 8:44 pm 
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JPH wrote:
How's the road up to Dingford?

Nice in places, rough as hell in several others--particularly two of the stream crossings.  You're really going to want to get out your vehicle and scout the crossing.  Maybe move a rock or two.  That last one (not sure of the name) has gotten much deeper where it meets the road and people have been detouring upstream and wrangling around back to the road.  Someone has come along and cut the downed trees--all but one.  It's hanging up in the air about 12 feet.  Easy to pass beneath it unless you are in a sailboat.  ~z
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mosey
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PostTue May 19, 2020 11:33 pm 
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JPH wrote:
zephyr wrote:
Yes, but the O.P. was referring to Taylor River TH.

The Taylor River TH and the picnic area are essentially one and the same now since the road is permanently blocked in that spot, so parking, picnic tables & toilet. 

It was actually reopened to the original Snoqualmie Lakes TH at the end of last year, it goes about a half mile further now. Looks like it was just closed to decommission some culverts at the beginning while they finished the Garfield Ledges TH.
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JPH
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PostWed May 20, 2020 8:22 am 
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mosey wrote:
It was actually reopened to the original Snoqualmie Lakes TH at the end of last year

Oh nice, by the looks of the closure last time I was up there I figured it was permanent.
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Forum Index > Trail Talk > Now That's What I Call Another Forest Closure Question Volume #376257
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