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Brian R
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PostThu Jul 30, 2020 10:03 am 
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Hiked up Shriner Peak again yesterday. Flowers are out and the bugs are waking up. Mostly small mosquitoes near the top along with a few biting flies. No snow at all.

Now the question. I've always been a big advocate for unrestricted access to trails--the only limits driven by the size of the parking lot. But yesterday I ran into a pair of trail runners, one male & one female--and their dog--coming down from the top while my brother and I were ascending. It was a narrow part of the trail. They indicated they weren't slowing down, glancing at their watches several times to convey their haste and the importance of their quest. My understanding, after 58 years of doing this, is that downhill yields to uphill. Normally I would just step aside and get out of their way, but the self-important vibe trail runners are giving off nowadays is annoying me, so I politely told the lead runner "hey, just an FYI, downhill yields." She immediately went into a tirade as we passed and, when we were a safe distance apart, her male companion began his bluster--which we ignored. Oh, and did I mention they had their dog with them. In a national park.

Are trail runners becoming an issue? Last year I ran into a couple dozen of them on the Ipsut Pass trail. They were supported by two vans with food and beverage set up in the Mowich Lake parking lot and I suspect they were running the Wonderland with full/paid support. I stepped out of their way then. I'm not getting out of trail runners' way any more unless the uphill/downhill etiquette rules demand it.

Any thoughts?
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JonnyQuest
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PostThu Jul 30, 2020 10:28 am 
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This thread won't be the same without TAH and BIG/DIY Steve.
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coldrain108
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PostThu Jul 30, 2020 10:43 am 
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I just did the High Divide Loop (in 4 days) and ran into a lot of trail runners doing it in one day.   Almost all were very polite and slowed to a walk when they approached us.   It was about 80% mask wearing.  It helps to be a big person that could send them tumbling off the trail if they decided to bull rush through.  Skinny little wimps that they are  pig.gif

The importance of the quest is just so comical.  I deal with the Burke Gilman trail daily and am amazed at those glancing at their watches while on the tour de Burke.  They get real angry if they have to slow down for pedestrians.  I guess nothing is fun unless there is competition involved.

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"The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watch and do nothing"  - Albert Einstein
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neek
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PostThu Jul 30, 2020 11:06 am 
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Brian R wrote:
Any thoughts?

I can't prove it, but am pretty sure most people were put on earth just to annoy me.  (And I suppose that's my problem, not theirs.)  Thanks for calling these folks out.  I'm never brave enough.  IME most trail runners are very polite, more so than casual hikers.  Whether things are getting worse, I dunno.  Seems like that to me but I could just be getting older and crankier.
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Sculpin
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PostThu Jul 30, 2020 12:37 pm 
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neek wrote:
am pretty sure most people were put on earth just to annoy me

Just checked the user's manual that came with my brain, and sure enough, right there on Page 1:

Mission Statement:  Annoy Neek

Never noticed that before.  hmmm.gif

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Between every two pines is a doorway to the new world. - John Muir
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neek
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PostThu Jul 30, 2020 12:42 pm 
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Now you're mocking me!  So annoying!!   cool.gif
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Brushbuffalo
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PostThu Jul 30, 2020 1:55 pm 
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Brian R wrote:
Any thoughts?

Most trail runners I know or those I encounter whom I don't know are courteous on the trail.
As a so- called 'living legend of trail running' ( no lie, according to Trailrunner  Magazine,  June/July 2001) I HAVE to be polite seeing how I represent the 'brand.' Although I am much slower these days and most trail users don't know me from Joe Blow,  I would be courteous anyway.

Even if a runner is pursuing the fad of FKT ( ' fastest known time'), being rude or a danger to other users is very poor.

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Passing rocks and trees like they were standing still
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Routes
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PostThu Jul 30, 2020 2:57 pm 
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Brian R wrote:
She immediately went into a tirade as we passed and, when we were a safe distance apart, her male companion began his bluster--which we ignored.

What was the case they were making?
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Brian R
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PostThu Jul 30, 2020 7:16 pm 
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Just a string of profanity and something about her dog. Couldn't hear what the guy was saying at all as he was a good 30-40 yards past when he started in. She continued yelling up at us from the switchback below.  I just hope they were able to pause the activity clocks on their Garmins or somehow mitigate this lost output on Strava!
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graywolf
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PostThu Jul 30, 2020 8:13 pm 
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Most trail runners I've encountered have been courteous and friendly - the two you met sound like jerks.

Dogs in national parks are very common nowadays - people blatantly ignore the rules.  Last Sunday as we started our hike up the Hoh River, a young couple in front of us with their two dogs (at least they were on leashes) walked right past the sign that said "No Pets" and proceeded up the trail.  The guy stopped to let us pass, so I decided to have a friendly conversation with them about the no pets rule.  It went pretty well, especially with the man; the woman started to get huffy, but fortunately the conversation never got heated.  I informed them that if they encountered a ranger, they would probably be fined for the infraction.  At this point they turned around, but they also stated that the "ranger" at the campground (maybe the campground host?) said it would be okay for them to walk the trail before 10:00 AM.  I reported this "ranger" at the campground to ONP so they could investigate further.

The lack of backcountry rangers is really starting to be noticed - I yelled at a guy a few weeks ago who was flying his drone just south of Wedding Rocks on the coast.

Trail etiquette?  Pretty rare these days from what I've experienced.

Masks?  Not always necessary on the trails if you can stay at least six feet apart and pass each other.  I still wear a half-sized buff that I can pull up over my nose & mouth to make the other hikers feel more comfortable.

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Bosterson
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PostThu Jul 30, 2020 11:38 pm 
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Aren't trail runners just subject to the same law that governs hikers, climbers, drivers, bicyclists, shoppers, tourists, et al?


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Follow the river until it turns to ice. Follow the ice until it turns to rock. Follow the rock until it turns to sky. Then we will be there.
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Randito
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PostFri Jul 31, 2020 2:30 am 
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Kinda hard to believe they were pursuing a FKT or even a Personal Best if they took time to rant on you or for that matter had a dog with them.

If they were really concerned about their time, they wouldn't bother with shenanigans like pointing at their watch or listening,  much less responding to your unsolicited instructions on correct trail etiquette.  They would just keep running.

Sounds to me like their just selfish jerks -- or this post is a troll.
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neek
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PostFri Jul 31, 2020 5:01 am 
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Brian R wrote:
I just hope they were able to pause the activity clocks on their Garmins or somehow mitigate this lost output on Strava!

Come to think of it, that's a good reason to use strava.  You don't have to make your activities public.  If you encounter a d-bag who uses it as well, you can track them down in the flyby.  What then, I'm not sure--just the satisfaction of knowing, I guess.
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Stefan
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PostFri Jul 31, 2020 10:59 am 
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IMO.  Just ignorant people.  Gotta deal with them all the time.

I find the vast people on trails too polite.  I find it funny I will step aside most of the time and the other person will too!

So, in essence, a couple of bad apples....don't make us all bad.  The big picture is what you gotta remind yourself.

And it does not matter if you go down or up...yield to be polite.  And don't carry the baggage that there are ignorant people out there--you will have  great life.

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graywolf
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PostFri Jul 31, 2020 2:32 pm 
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Stefan wrote:
And it does not matter if you go down or up...yield to be polite.

While I mostly agree with this statement, I still find it aggravating when I'm carrying a large backpack and the oncoming person is carrying a daypack (or nothing at all), and they assume I should move for them.

It seems obvious to me that the person who is carrying the smaller load, and is therefore more maneuverable, should yield the right of way. In fact, that is part of trail etiquette that I was taught back in the late 1960's.

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