Forum Index > Trail Talk > Backcountry Campsite ethics?
Previous :: Next Topic  
Author Message
Noheaperture
Nohea



Joined: 25 Aug 2018
Posts: 94 | TRs
Location: Issaquah
Noheaperture
  Top

Nohea
PostThu Aug 13, 2020 2:53 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Recently went on a cross country trip in the cascades to an extremely remote collection of lakes. A good 17 mile approach left no trails or human travel as far as I could see, including proper areas to camp.
I had a few choices from what I could find:
1. Sleep in the Remnants of a thick muddy tarn
2. Attempt to pitch my tent on a large slanted  boulder field.
3. Camp in a grassy knoll 15 feet from an outlet stream.

Of course 200 feet from a water source wasn’t possible in this case but I opted for 3. I’m curious as to what others would do in a situation like this for future trips when traveling to places without morally responsible sites?
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Schenk
Off Leash Man



Joined: 16 Apr 2012
Posts: 2353 | TRs
Location: Traveling, with the bear, to the other side of the Mountain
Schenk
  Top

Off Leash Man
PostThu Aug 13, 2020 3:40 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
In my opinion, none of your options were good. #3 was probably the best option for you, as you had chosen. Fortunately grass is resilient and will grow back.

On a related note...the Wind River Range, especially near the popular areas, was overrun this past couple weeks. People ignored the 200' rule and gave many lame excuses when I asked them why they did it. So many newbies, so many who were ignorant of LNT practices. Most disturbing were the many people who actually proclaimed the 200' rule did not apply to them because "we got a late start".  These hordes also planted plenty of toilet paper gardens, in plain sight! Many of these idiots were to lazy to even venture more than about 10' from their camp to poop.
How do I know what their camps looked like you ask? Because they were camped right next to the damn trail. Don't even get me started on their dog's poop and how they handled those events. What slobs....There will be SO much dog and human poop in some areas that it won't be safe to walk about in them.
Rant over.

--------------
Nature exists with a stark indifference to humans' situation.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
Ski
><((((°>



Joined: 28 May 2005
Posts: 11298 | TRs
Location: tacoma
Ski
  Top

><((((°>
PostThu Aug 13, 2020 3:52 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Noheaperture wrote:
Camp in a grassy knoll 15 feet from an outlet stream.

Sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do.

I've spent the night sleeping
just off the roadway in a grassy ditch near East Eagle Creek,
curled up around a tiny noble fir just below the summit of Craggy Peak,
at the downstream end of a tiny island in the middle of a river,
on a 5-foot-wide rock ledge above Copper Creek in the Eagle Cap Wilderness,
on a 3-foot wide rock ledge on the east side of Huckleberry Mountain,
on countless gravel bars where there was simply no way to be 200 feet away from anything,
and right in the middle of the trail when my flashlight and all three BIC lighters failed one night.

Just do your best to not leave any reminders of your visit to those who follow.

Easy peasy. up.gif

--------------
"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach. 
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Slugman
It’s a Slugfest!



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 16436 | TRs

Slugman
  Top

It’s a Slugfest!
PostThu Aug 13, 2020 4:02 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Your story barely got a quiver from the needle on my outrage-o-meter.  headrub.gif

--------------
“The jerking motion of a knee does not reflect the operation of a mind”  Slugman, January 24th 2020
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
80skeys
Member
Member


Joined: 22 Jul 2019
Posts: 181 | TRs

80skeys
  Top

Member
PostFri Aug 21, 2020 11:44 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Noheaperture wrote:
Of course 200 feet from a water source wasn’t possible in this case

So, this brings up something that I'm curious about and perhaps someone on here knows the answer to.

Given that people are allowed to take pack animals into the backcountry (and sometimes cows are allowed to roam), I don't understand the logic of "camping 200 feet from a water source". Supposedly this is because you're not supposed to urinate or defecate near water so as to avoid contaminating it. But with pack animals, cows, and of course a zillion wild animals defecate around water all the time, it seems like a mute point.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
80skeys
Member
Member


Joined: 22 Jul 2019
Posts: 181 | TRs

80skeys
  Top

Member
PostFri Aug 21, 2020 11:47 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Schenk wrote:
the Wind River Range, especially near the popular areas, was overrun this past couple weeks

Where are those people coming from - the West Coast? Or are they Wyoming locals?
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
olderthanIusedtobe
Member
Member


Joined: 05 Sep 2011
Posts: 6933 | TRs
Location: Shoreline
olderthanIusedtobe
  Top

Member
PostFri Aug 21, 2020 11:52 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
80skeys wrote:
Where are those people coming from - the West Coast? Or are they Wyoming locals?

The Rockies are the nearest "real mountains" for a large portion of the country.  Those people could've been coming from pretty much everywhere.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
joker
seeker



Joined: 12 Aug 2006
Posts: 7864 | TRs
Location: state of confusion
joker
  Top

seeker
PostFri Aug 21, 2020 12:47 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
I drove cross  country to  backpack in the Winds (and a few other  areas  including The  Bob) when I lived in MA. There are a lot of NOLS alum who bring news of the loveliness of the area to friends around the country, among other  ways  of learning about it.

As for the  choices, 3 seems not unreasonable. Have you  noticed how many lightly  traveled trails disappear when they cross grassy meadows? If that spot isn't getting  frequent campers, the grass likely won't have to "grow back"  so much as just pop back up after a few rain/sun  cycles. Presumably you didn't leave  trash  and  you  pooped well away from the water...
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
Noheaperture
Nohea



Joined: 25 Aug 2018
Posts: 94 | TRs
Location: Issaquah
Noheaperture
  Top

Nohea
PostFri Aug 21, 2020 1:28 pm 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
joker wrote:
Presumably you didn't leave  trash  and  you  pooped well away from the water...

Haha I met a guy who told me he used to relieve himself right on the rivers and streams in Utah because it provided easy clean up. 🤮
I try to avoid telling people what to do because it is rarely received well but I needed to mention that’s extremely wrong.

With that being said, I carry a poop tube For those emergency moments but luckily find the ability to dig a cat hole and clear out when I’m below tree line (with the help of caffeine pills)
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
BigBrunyon
Member
Member


Joined: 19 Mar 2015
Posts: 896 | TRs
Location: the fitness gyms!!
BigBrunyon
  Top

Member
PostSat Aug 22, 2020 12:55 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
The 'backcountry bidet' method(where you stop at a stream, pull down your pants, and squat so the moving water cleans y'up) gained popularity in the early 90's. Allegedly still being practiced by certain demographics presently.

--------------
YOU NEVER KNOW!!
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Reply to topic Reply with quote
moonspots
Happy Curmudgeon



Joined: 03 Feb 2007
Posts: 2283 | TRs
Location: North Dakota
moonspots
  Top

Happy Curmudgeon
PostSat Aug 22, 2020 8:21 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
BigBrunyon wrote:
The 'backcountry bidet' method(where you stop at a stream, pull down your pants, and squat so the moving water cleans y'up) gained popularity in the early 90's. Allegedly still being practiced by certain demographics presently.

Ah, so THAT's why my filter's been clogging up! 😆

--------------
"Out, OUT you demons of Stupidity"! - St Dogbert, patron Saint of Technology
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
80skeys
Member
Member


Joined: 22 Jul 2019
Posts: 181 | TRs

80skeys
  Top

Member
PostSat Aug 22, 2020 8:50 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
So let's get back to my question: what's the rationale for not relieving oneself near the water, considering that horses and other pack animals - which poop near water a lot more - are permitted in many of those areas.
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
Ski
><((((°>



Joined: 28 May 2005
Posts: 11298 | TRs
Location: tacoma
Ski
  Top

><((((°>
PostSat Aug 22, 2020 8:57 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Cholera, for one thing. (Among no doubt other issues.)

In a perfect world, it might be possible to train all the wild animals to not poop in rivers and lakes, but that's kind of unrealistic.

It's much easier to toilet-train humans.

And maybe this is just wild speculation on my part, but most of those animals are herbivores and they don't carry around the sort of pathogens in their digestive systems that humans do. I could well be off the mark there.

--------------
"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach. 
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
moonspots
Happy Curmudgeon



Joined: 03 Feb 2007
Posts: 2283 | TRs
Location: North Dakota
moonspots
  Top

Happy Curmudgeon
PostSat Aug 22, 2020 9:10 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Ski wrote:
And maybe this is just wild speculation on my part, but most of those animals are herbivores and they don't carry around the sort of pathogens in their digestive systems that humans do. I could well be off the mark there.

Ski, I suspect that you're correct there. I don't know why exactly, but it SEEMS to be about right.

--------------
"Out, OUT you demons of Stupidity"! - St Dogbert, patron Saint of Technology
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
80skeys
Member
Member


Joined: 22 Jul 2019
Posts: 181 | TRs

80skeys
  Top

Member
PostSat Aug 22, 2020 9:25 am 
Reply to topic Reply with quote
Drinking stream water that contained cholera bacteria would not be a problem if filtering it with a Katadyne first. But cholera bacteria only survives in ice for a few weeks, so I wonder whether it's even possible for it to become endemic in Rocky mountain streams?
Back to top
View user's profile Search for posts by this user Send private message Send e-mail Reply to topic Reply with quote
  Display:     All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Forum Index > Trail Talk > Backcountry Campsite ethics?
Jump to:   
Search this topic:

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
   Use Disclaimer Powered by phpBB Privacy Policy