[BigBrunyon]

This year there needs to be an unspoken agreement amongst those in the know to ONLY drive alone in LARGE cars to stevens pass. Filling up that parking situation with very few actual snow users is the only way that we will be able to rise to power this winter!

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YOU NEVER KNOW!!

[altasnob]

Crystal's current Special Use Permit expires in 2032.

I do not dispute the Special Use Permit gives ski areas the ability to regulate uphill travel. For Crystal, what concerns me is that their Special Use Permit area is essentially the entire U shaped valley. In other words, if Crystal wanted to, they could possibly prevent uphill travel not only around chair lifts and marked runs, but areas that are currently considered out of bounds. Crystal has started to do guided snowshoe hikes to Bullion Basin (inside Crystal's permit area), hiking up narrow trails as skiers are coming down. What happens when Crystal decides the backcountry skiers and non-paying snowshoers are cutting into their snowshoe profits and cuts off uphill travel (unless you hire a Crystal guide).

I hope when the permits are next negotiated, the Forest Service recognizes the rise of non-lift served users and makes it a condition of of the permit to make reasonable accommodations for uphill travel (outside of ski area boundaries) and parking for non paying customers (who are recreating outside of ski area boundaries). This hasn't been much of a problem in Washington, to date, because there still is not that many winter users. But we will see more and more conflicts down the road.

Here is Crystal's permit area. There are two new chairlifts approved by the Forest Service, one from B lot to Kelly's Gap, one towards Bullion Basin, like the chairlift that existed there previously. The B lot to Kelly's Gap lift makes sense as it gets people to Green Valley in times of high wind when the gondola and REX can't run, but if the Bullion Basin lift is ever built you can pretty much kiss any uphill travel anywhere near Crystal good bye:

[Randito]

FWIW: In the '80s Kittitas County attempted to levy its admissions tax on lift tickets sold at Hyak, Ski Acres and Snoqualmie Summit (now known as Summits East, Central and West) the ski areas successfully exempted themselves from the tax by asserting the the lift ticket fee was solely for the privilege of riding the lifts and not for admission to the ski area.

Alpental lies in King county, so this doesn't apply there.

[jinx'sboy]

[treeswarper]

There's always...White Pass.

I don't think skiing would be very enjoyable this year.  I like going inside and having a beverage and warming up.  A friend of mine who gets cold quickly, but loves to go ski and is a very good skier is driving an hour, going skiing for a couple of hours, then gets too cold and drives back home with heat on high and heated seats heating. 

White Pass is selling food, but I've been told there is no eating indoors.  I do not know how they are handling the restrooms.  Pee in the parking lot???

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What's especially fun about sock puppets is that you can make each one unique and individual, so that they each have special characters. And they don't have to be human––animals and aliens are great possibilities

[graffiti]

[Randito]

Base snow depth at White Pass is currently 14 inches.   Might want to wait for more snow.

[treeswarper]

[seahuskies]

Another article today posted about snowshoe routes

https://www.seattletimes.com/life/outdoors/10-washington-snowshoeing-routes-to-help-you-get-out-and-spread-out-this-winter/

[jackchinook]

[kiliki]

[kiliki]

[Randito]

[altasnob]

Crystal is gracious enough to allow uphill travel on the side of the groomed Quicksilver run. But Crystal is under no obligation to continue this and could cut off this access at any moment. All it will take is a downhill skier to careen into an uphill traveler and Crystal may chose to cut this off. Or an uphill traveler disregarding the rules and venturing into in bounds avy patrolled terrain (which has happened). This is one of the only situations I can think of where a ski area lets people hike up a groomed ski run when the lifts are spinning. I would not be surprised if they cut this off as more and more people are going up, and coming down.

Also, Crystal seems to get more and more restrictive on uphill travel each year. For instance, this year, prior to the official opening, Crystal stated all uphill travel was prohibited (meaning you could not hike Quicksilver to Silver Basin before the resort opened as you could in previous years). They did this because there was a chance Crystal would do avy control in Silver Basin and did not want any incidents. But then it rained and they never did avy control in Silver Basin prior to the resort opening. Moreover, when Crystal says no uphill travel is allowed, not only does it cut off access up Quicksilver to Silver Basin, it also cuts off access to the summer trail that takes you to Bear Gap and the PCT because this trail briefly travels across the Gold Hills ski run. That trail does not cross any area where Crystal avy control work could pose a threat to uphill travelers, but the trail is still technically closed when they ban uphill travel.

I agree with you that a Bullion Basin lift makes no sense based on lack of snow. But ski areas make their money on beginner and intermediate terrain, not expert terrain, so I can see why Crystal is interested in it. I can't imagine a Bullion Basin lift helping backcountry access. As noted above, we are lucky that Crystal lets you skin up a groomed Quicksilver run and I do not see this continuing indefinitely for liability reasons.

From a business perspective, there is no reason for Crystal to try to maintain access for uphill travelers. Crystal stops selling tickets because their parking lot is full, not because they think the lift lines are too long. Uphill travelers take away parking for paying customers and cut into Crystal's bottom line. So I see restrictions increasing, not decreasing.

[Randito]