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HikerJohn
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PostFri Jul 02, 2021 9:01 pm 
Campbell-Global, the folks that owned and operated the Snoqualmie Forest (the former Weyerhauser lands on the North Fork of the Snoqualmie) has been sold to JP Morgan

Sounds like they are looking at it from a "Green Economy" viewpoint, especially carbon stuff, so not sure it this means they'll slow down logging, keep it up, or ???????

https://www.jpmorganchase.com/news-stories/jpmorgan-asset-management-acquires-campbell-global

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puzzlr
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PostSun Jul 04, 2021 4:27 pm 
Thanks for the link. Some questions are left unanswered. Will they continue the (paid) permit system to drive the roads on this land? Will they keep logging? For part of it that seems like a good use -- it's not so interesting for recreational values. But you can bet J.P. Morgan isn't doing this out of altruism. Maybe it's a conservation angle where they sell tree growth/planting credits to organizations or companies trying to meet their zero-carbon pledges. I'm not implying that's a bad thing, but can be complicated.

I assume that King County still owns the development rights to this land which they purchased some time ago when they couldn't come up with the money to buy it outright. I wish I had a link for that.

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yukon222
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PostSun Jul 04, 2021 4:59 pm 
Puzzlr, here’s a link that discusses the King County purchase of the development rights.

https://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/stories/2004/08/30/daily35.html

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thunderhead
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PostMon Jul 12, 2021 7:50 am 
I hope the permit access system for biking stays in place.

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Schroder
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PostMon Jul 12, 2021 3:36 pm 
Weyerhaeuser also sold 145,000 acres to Hampton Resources that has, among others, the Darrington sawmill.

Weyerhaeuser To Sell 145,000 Acres Of Timberlands In Washington For $266 Mln

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Dick B
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Dick B
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PostMon Jul 12, 2021 7:50 pm 
Back in the day when I was a practicing forester, one method of buying and managing timber land by some large lumber companies was to "cut out and get out". Buyers wanted to recover their investment as quickly as possible, and move on.
I worked in Oregon, which had several Weyerhauser tree farms, and associated mills. One farm was in Coos Bay. It  butted up against the state forest I helped manage. They had the largest mill in the area. It is gone, and is now a casino. As far as I know the company still owns the tree farm, but I believe all the merchantable timber has been harvested. Same thing happened on their tree farm outside of Klamath Falls. That mill is gone also. There may be another down in the Eugene area.
All the green stuff; carbon credits, off sets and other environmental schemes are new to me. Managing it for carbon credits may be the reason for the purchase. My bet would be; if there is any merchantable timber it will be quickly logged to take advantage of the rising price of timber products.
Good look on your future road access. I assume it allows you to get to different trail heads.

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jinx'sboy
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PostMon Jul 12, 2021 8:09 pm 
The high retail lumber prices may persist for a while yet, but the classic ‘short squeeze’ in lumber is already about done.

https://www.nasdaq.com/market-activity/commodities/lbs

Prices took off this spring from the typical $500/1000 bd ft of the last few years.  They climbed to $1600/1000 in early May - and are now trading below $750/1000.  No - retail prices dont exactly mirror the futures prices - but they aren’t far off.

One analyst I was reading figures that by Labor Day lumber will be about where it was a few months ago.

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treeswarper
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PostMon Jul 12, 2021 8:36 pm 
My sources have said that log prices and timber prices did not rise as much as the lumber prices.  Cedar was an exception, but it is usually high anyway.

Just read where LUMBER prices are tumbling.

Timber is the standing tree--AKA stumpage, logs are those things on a truck, and lumber is a finished product ready to build something with.  The terms sometimes get mixed up.

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Lindsay
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PostSat Jul 17, 2021 6:13 pm 
puzzlr, KC retained the development rights when the lands went from Hancock to Campbell Global.

The County's TDR program continues to pursue selling those DRs and has done some transactions:
https://kingcounty.gov/services/environment/stewardship/sustainable-building/transfer-development-rights/bank/bank_sales.aspx

Given that the County has more land conservation goals, the SF should remain in forest land. The County isn't likely to sell the DRs back!

It will be interesting to see how JPM steers CG. In addition to the SF, CG holds 150,000 plus acres of highly productive (good carbon storage potential) lands along the Oregon Coast - among 1.7 million acres globally.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2021-06-29/jpmorgan-s-purchase-of-forestry-asset-manager-may-not-be-enough-to-go-green
https://www.vox.com/22349601/banks-fossil-fuels-finance-trillions-climate-change?

Hopefully the Hampton Mill will stay running now that Hampton has more certainty over its local woodshed. It's long concerned me that forest restoration projects on the eastside of the Central Cascades have to haul to Darrington. Mill locations, fuel and trucking costs, make it hard to do fuel reduction and restoration thinning projects that can cover their own costs.

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rossb
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PostSun Jul 18, 2021 5:33 pm 
treeswarper wrote:
My sources have said that log prices and timber prices did not rise as much as the lumber prices.

That makes sense to me. With the pandemic, the lumber mills expected an economic downturn, so they cut processing. But demand actually went up, as a lot of stimulus money went into home remodels (and no one was spending money on going out, traveling, etc.). Now the mills have opened up again, and demand is shifting back.

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Anne Elk
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PostSun Jul 18, 2021 9:34 pm 
Dick B wrote:
...  one method of buying and managing timber land by some large lumber companies was to "cut out and get out". Buyers wanted to recover their investment as quickly as possible, and move on ... I worked in Oregon, which had several Weyerhauser tree farms, and associated mills. One farm was in Coos Bay. It  butted up against the state forest I helped manage. They had the largest mill in the area. It is gone, and is now a casino.

I get real skeptical about positive environmental outcomes when I hear about investment companies and their involvement with forestry; even more so when one vampire squid swallows another.  From the article Hiker John cited:
Quote:
"Carbon sequestration in forests worldwide will play an important role in carbon markets, and J.P. Morgan Asset Management expects to become an active participant in carbon offset markets as they develop.

That sounds a lot like the forestry equivalent of the vaunted "cap and trade" deals which, I believe, accomplished a lot less than the proponents claimed.

It's been a few decades but my past knowledge of such involved the acquisitions on the Mt. Loop Highway by the Timber Resources investment arm of The John Hancock Life Insurance Company. Some of the forestry-areas they acquired got rezoned and JH sold the cut land to Associated Sand & Gravel of Everett, itself owned by some Australian natural resources conglomerate. The quarry in question destroyed some kettle wetlands, and was/is pretty close to the Stilly. Of course JH's PR group was all rah-rah about their set-aside to the county for Robe Canyon Park, which was a pretty miniscule part of their surrounding holdings.

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wade63
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PostSun Jul 25, 2021 8:08 pm 
For sure is it's all about the dollar. If a corporation can tell itself it's doing good makes everyone feel better. Who doesn't want to feel good? Truth is JPM is looking to profit, it's what they do. Public lands are the only thing you and I may have a say in.

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Pyrites
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PostTue Jul 27, 2021 5:39 pm 
treeswarper wrote:
My sources have said that log prices and timber prices did not rise as much as the lumber prices.  Cedar was an exception, but it is usually high anyway.

Just read where LUMBER prices are tumbling.

Timber is the standing tree--AKA stumpage, logs are those things on a truck, and lumber is a finished product ready to build something with.  The terms sometimes get mixed up.

I’ve always called those old 8” x 26” clear grain Doug fir beams you see in old mill construction, timber , or as the building codes call it Heavy Timber.

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treeswarper
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treeswarper
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PostSun Aug 08, 2021 11:24 am 
Pyrites wrote:
treeswarper wrote:
My sources have said that log prices and timber prices did not rise as much as the lumber prices.  Cedar was an exception, but it is usually high anyway.

Just read where LUMBER prices are tumbling.

Timber is the standing tree--AKA stumpage, logs are those things on a truck, and lumber is a finished product ready to build something with.  The terms sometimes get mixed up.

I’ve always called those old 8” x 26” clear grain Doug fir beams you see in old mill construction, timber , or as the building codes call it Heavy Timber.

Ah yes.  And we have timber framed houses also.

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Kim Brown
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PostWed Aug 11, 2021 9:01 am 
Lindsay wrote:
informative post.

Lindsay, thanks for the great details!

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