Forum Index > Full Moon Saloon > It's a sad day for particle physics
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HitTheTrail
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PostFri Apr 08, 2022 6:04 am 
The standard model of particle physics is said to be the best model ever written down, except for two small problems. It can’t account for 95% of all matter/energy in the universe or explain why the universe exists at all since the big bang should have annihilated itself. And now there is evidence that the rest of the model is falling apart also. Back to square one I guess!

Matt
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cdestroyer
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PostFri Apr 08, 2022 7:20 am 
Holy fabrizinni, not page one! ya I read that initial quark what supposedly started the big bang turned out to be a piece of lint caught in the filter. oh well, so much for modern science.

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neek
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PostFri Apr 08, 2022 7:55 am 
cdestroyer wrote:
so much for modern science
No kidding! I'm going back to leeches and trepanation. (Well, of course, medical leeches are still a thing...) I know little about modern physics and have been hearing about things "breaking the standard model" for years; would like to understand how exactly this is different.

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Cyclopath
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PostFri Apr 08, 2022 9:14 am 
The standard model is the most successful theory we have. We know it's "wrong." There's nothing more exciting to theoretical physicists than finding weird things that don't agree with the model, because they suggest we could be on the verge of discovering new physics.

philfort, neek
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Bosterson
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PostFri Apr 08, 2022 9:24 am 
If the mass of the W boson is wrong, I don't want to be right. Time to go back to the four humors and the luminiferous aether.

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Randito
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PostFri Apr 08, 2022 10:05 am 
Some of the greatest advancements have come when observation and experiment didn't match theory. E.g. Kepler's elliptical obit formula was a result of Tyco Brahe's precise observations of planetary movements.

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neek
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PostFri Apr 08, 2022 2:39 pm 
Interesting discussion of this on yesterday's Science podcast. Sounds like there's a fair amount mystery and even controversy around this.

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cdestroyer
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PostFri Apr 08, 2022 7:02 pm 
I am not fully up on a lot of the physics stuff,tho I do try to understand some of it. The most intriguing is quantum entanglemt. two sub atomics caged at a distance and what you do to one the other knows instantly without being in contact.....einstein did not like this...he called it spooky action at a distance... this dark matter and dark energy is another..

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Cyclopath
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PostMon Apr 11, 2022 6:46 pm 
I'm posting this because it's fun, but also to share just how far we've come. Wheeler thought the fact that every electron has identical charge and mass was something that needed an explanation. How do two electrons on the opposite sides of the universe know to be the same? (The answer is because they're both excitations in the same electron field that pervades the universe. But we didn't know that yet.) Well, maybe they weren't two electrons, across the universe or anywhere else. Maybe there's only one. A single electron, that vibrates backwards and forward in time, traversing the entire history of the universe in both directions. At any moment it only looks like there are multiple electrons, just like if you only see part of the landscape a bend in a river can look like two rivers.

cdestroyer, HitTheTrail
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HitTheTrail
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PostMon Apr 11, 2022 7:55 pm 
Hmmm..Interesting vid, thanks for posting. I have watched other stuff by them but never this one. Effective analogy comparing it to crossing a winding river.

Cyclopath
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PostTue Apr 12, 2022 4:50 am 
cdestroyer wrote:
The most intriguing is quantum entanglemt. two sub atomics caged at a distance and what you do to one the other knows instantly without being in contact
My (quite possibly imperfect) understanding is that the two particles need to be created at the same time, or be close together to become 'entangled', and then even if you take them far from each other they still maintain their connection.

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Malachai Constant
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PostTue Apr 12, 2022 8:08 am 
It is never a sad day for particle physics merely means there is something interesting out there, that is science.

"You do not laugh when you look at the mountains, or when you look at the sea." Lafcadio Hearn

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HitTheTrail
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PostThu Apr 14, 2022 3:42 pm 
GaliWalker wrote:
My (quite possibly imperfect) understanding is that the two particles need to be created at the same time, or be close together to become 'entangled', and then even if you take them far from each other they still maintain their connection.
Here is a simple explanation of quantum entanglement It is not quite as spooky as it is made out to be.

philfort, Cyclopath
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uww
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PostMon Apr 25, 2022 10:11 am 
The good news for the standard model is about 70% of scientific studies are not reproducible.

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