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Larry
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Joined: 22 Feb 2003
Posts: 1084 | TRs | Pics
Location: Kitsap |
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Larry
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 Sat Oct 11, 2003 4:18 pm |
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| Tom wrote: | | Where do people get the idea photoshop = manipulation. Anyone who shoots with a DSLR knows to get the most out of the camera you do the LEAST amount of processing in camera and post process after the fact, everything from saturation and sharpness to tweaking white balance and exposure. This is no more manipulation than is done in the film darkroom so I don't see how it's manipulation. Now, if you're going to tweak things like saturation beyond natural levels then I would agree it's "manipulation" (to an extent) but then someone could make the same argument about shooting with a polarizer or velvia film which I see nothing wrong with. |
Good point, Tom. It's all in the eye of the beholder, and a personal choice for sure. Besides, Ansel Adams "manipulated" many of his images in the darkroom. So, maybe it's a matter of "degrees", and even that is a personal opinion of the individual.
Tweaking things beyond natural levels won't usually get anyone very far anyway, because over-tweaking makes thins pretty darn unnatural, and then it's obvious that it has been "over tweaked".
And, yeah, I use a polarizer and Velvia about a third of the time, so that might be someone's personal call that I'm manipulating the image.
But, it is all okay with me. Heck, even those 3D "manipulated" computer images can be great. If I like what I see, I don't even worry about "manipulation".
But, to reassure you, Newbie...I usually just post the raw image on here after a quick scan, without "manipulation" other than the crop and sharpen that I might give it. I figure this isn't an artsy-craftsy site, and that people just like to see the places. So, I post images of places (as long as they're not fragile places that don't need the notoriety....Wait!...Wait!...that's another thread!). 
A good case in point is my current avatar image. It was taken with a point-and-shoot, but was one of those "keepers". It is "fuzzy" and might even benefit from a bit of straightening and saturation. But, all I did was crop it, because I sort of like the fuzzy stuff in it, as it lends a sense of atmosphere (that wasn't intentional, just turned out to suit the subject matter...a happy accident). However, if I was to make a large print, then I think I would possibly check out some saturation options, and some sharpening options, just to make the print not look way too fuzzy.
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blindie
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Joined: 17 Apr 2003
Posts: 26 | TRs | Pics
Location: Snoqualmie |
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blindie
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Tue Nov 04, 2003 12:49 am |
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I used to feel if I could get a great shot with my digital camera I could save the time in Photoshop. I picked up a book by Martin Evening called Adobe Photoshop 7 for Photographers and now can't imagine having a photo printed without at least adjusting the levels or curves. It makes all the differance in the world.
With a 6 MP camera I still can't do what I can with Velvia but because of the workflow advantage of digital I shoot very little film now. I would love to get my hands on medium or large format equipment. And with all that extra resolution to work with I'd even hike with it. Some day...
My favorite size to print is 20x30. I use ofoto.com and have been really pleased with the results. I have had good luck even print photos from my 4 MP Powershot s40. I don't bother with inkjet because my first stylus color prints are all faded. I know they claim to have inks that last 90+ years now but how do they know? The Photographic process has been around for quite some time. With services like ofoto.com it is easy and inexpensive to get print up to 20 x 30.
How do you get something like a 30 x 30 printed?
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Newt
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Joined: 21 Dec 2001
Posts: 3176 | TRs | Pics
Location: Down the road and around the corner |
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Newt
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Sat Nov 08, 2003 8:56 am |
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Hey Mr. Larry, what's the difference between the Yashica Mat EM & G models?
After wanting the Canon EOS 3 I got to thinking of mf. The Mamiya 645 is nice. But $$$. Then got to remembering the Mat. Then thinking 330. Oh the choices.
Still thinkin non-digital.
NN
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
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Newt
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Joined: 21 Dec 2001
Posts: 3176 | TRs | Pics
Location: Down the road and around the corner |
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Newt
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Mon Nov 10, 2003 8:03 pm |
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Couldn't get there
There was a problem processing your request.
Maybe This?
What do I need to do to view full size?
NN
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
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Tom
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Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 17854 | TRs | Pics
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Tom
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Mon Nov 10, 2003 8:09 pm |
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| Quote: | | access to your original JPEGs through Yahoo! Photos will end on September 30, unless you are an SBC Yahoo! customer. |
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Damian
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Joined: 18 Dec 2001
Posts: 3260 | TRs | Pics
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Damian
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Mon Nov 10, 2003 9:14 pm |
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The original link took you to the full size pic. Gues the general public can't see it though.
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Newt
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Joined: 21 Dec 2001
Posts: 3176 | TRs | Pics
Location: Down the road and around the corner |
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Newt
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Sat Jan 03, 2004 9:42 am |
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Tom...I remember that you had a 10D in your possession. What prompted you to return it?
Thanks,
N
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
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Tom
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Joined: 15 Dec 2001
Posts: 17854 | TRs | Pics
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Tom
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Sat Jan 03, 2004 12:49 pm |
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- Need to carry 2 lenses to get both 35 mm and zoom (due to crop factor of DSLRs and no 4x zoom wide angle lenses)
- Lack of live preview in DSLRs
- Viewfinder framing never 100% accurate, requiring more crops / re-shoots (vs. 100% accurate with live preview of G# LCD)
- Large sensors in DSLRs means f/16 required to get large DOF for landscapes (lower shutter requires tripod vs...)
- Non-DSLR gives equivalent DOF at f/4 and can be handheld
- Hassle of changing lenses and keeping sensor clean from dust in DSLRs
- 10D pictures didn't look much better than G#
- Weight and Bulk of 10D w/ bag & lenses made hiking unpleasant
- Carrying G# in bag on hip belt is virtually unnoticeable
- Prefer G# color output. Blue sky on G# is velvia-like, while 10D / 300D sky seems too purple
- G# was 1/3 the cost and a better overall solution for me
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Newt
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Joined: 21 Dec 2001
Posts: 3176 | TRs | Pics
Location: Down the road and around the corner |
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Newt
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Sat Jan 03, 2004 12:56 pm |
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Thanks Tom. Guess that's reason enough. I've also read that it takes a softer photo. Not a + in my book.
Aside of weight etc in regards to backpacking, what's your take on the 1DS?
N
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
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Tom
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Joined: 15 Dec 2001
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Tom
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Sat Jan 03, 2004 1:33 pm |
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The 10D doesn't take a softer photo. It just has minimal processing applied in camera, allowing for greater post processing flexibility and user control of sharpness, saturation, and contrast. After owning a 10D you come to appreciate how much the definition of "unaltered" or "straight out of the camera" depends on in-camera processing and how nonsensical such claims are.
As far as the 1Ds, we're talking really big bucks and the same (if not more) issues, other than the crop factor going away. I'd only choose it over the 10D if you wanted to get the most out of really expensive lenses or wanted to make large prints on par with medium format. If you're looking for a new camera, I'd wait until spring. Technology changes too fast to plunk down serious $ in the middle of winter.
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Newt
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Joined: 21 Dec 2001
Posts: 3176 | TRs | Pics
Location: Down the road and around the corner |
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Newt
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Sat Jan 03, 2004 2:52 pm |
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Thanks, the 1DS & 10D are just wishful dreaming, researching and such. I have been debating over getting a DSLR or medium format film camera. Not right now, but it's in the works.
And hey, you don't have to wait til spring or summer to take photos. Least ways I don't think.
Thanks again
N
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
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Sore Feet
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Joined: 16 Dec 2001
Posts: 6307 | TRs | Pics
Location: Out There, Somewhere |
If you wanna pick up a cheap medium format camera, my friend found an old manual (ie no batteries required) Seagull rangefinder on ebay for under a hundred bucks. The pictures it produced were excellent. Good tool for learning, I'm thinking I may try to find something similar myself.
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Newt
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Joined: 21 Dec 2001
Posts: 3176 | TRs | Pics
Location: Down the road and around the corner |
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Newt
Short Timer
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Sat Jan 03, 2004 6:08 pm |
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I shot a lot of B/W with a Yashica Mat. That was a really cool camera. I've been really tempted to get another one. I've thought Mamiya 645 but that's some more wishful thinking and planning.
N
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
It's pretty safe to say that if we take all of man kinds accumulated knowledge, we still don't know everything. So, I hope you understand why I don't believe you know everything. But then again, maybe you do.
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