[salish]

Went down to REI and bought my TOPO! Washington State edition yesterday. What a neat program. I'm still playing around with it, but I think I'm really going to like it. I think it's super neat to be able to make the kind of map that you want to, rather than rely solely on what maps USGS sells you. And the route finger thing is pretty cool, too. Wish it made more of a 3D presentation, but it will work just fine for me.

[The Bard]

3D or not 3D, that is the question. Whether 'tis nobler up Sulphur via the slings and cameras of outrageous distortion. Aye, there's the tub. -- rubber ducky

[Sore Feet]

3d is just a novelty for me in those programs. I downloaded the demo of Maptech's software - with the feature that renders 3d in red and blue so you can look at it with 3d glasses and - which was immensely cool for just playing with, but the waypoint system in TOPO! is so incredibly useful to me, there was no question of TOPO! vs. Maptech (and Delormes was definitely out because it's slow and the quality of the scanned maps sucks). I only wish Nat'l Geographic would release the Canadian Topos with the same software...

[Tom]

[Malachai Constant]

If you have a fast connection you can download the USGS DRG's for free from http://duff.geology.washington.edu/data/raster/drg/ they as detailed as the regular maps you can then burn CD's of them and use oziexplorer with a gps.

[Sore Feet]

[Brian Curtis]

[Geek God]

I find many of these techno gadgets somewhat amusing. Recently I was on a winter slog up Lichtenberg Mt with a bunch of buddies. In the old days, we'd get to the top, extract our lunches from the packs, and sit on them (the packs, not the lunches). Then we'd chat, enjoy the views, maybe wander off here and there taking in other views, and generally enjoy nature. But on the recent trip, all the GPS enthusiasts spent nearly the whole time on the summit staring at their toys. What altitude did you get? Hey are we on the summit? (Of course, it was a perfect sunny day). Wow, it says on my map that I'm here. Ooh, check out my latest sternum strap, made from Unobtanium 468SX. Wow, where'd you buy those 95GXLIM590943-238485LKGFM boots, dude? Hey I just coated my compass (oops, archaic equipment) with bees wax imported from Upper Mongolia, which I got for 2% under wholesale from Dorkygear.com. It increases the accuracy of the compass 0.003 degrees over the bees wax that Joe Schmuck uses from Lower Mongolia or Pete Bagger uses from Mozambique. Now doncha spend too much time on 3D maps -- go to the field and enjoy the real thing! Then when you get there, be sure to take lots of photos with your Pentium 2.77 Ghz digital cameras, which you can store 3,000 images on one chip, and then look at all your pictures while sitting at the lake!!

[Sore Feet]

Well somebody obviously didn't get any toys for christmas.

[salish]

[Odonata]

Right on Cliff. If you have a computer and are a hiker, there is little argument against one of these programs. I use Topo but not with a gps. The ability to make your own maps and send them email to other Topo users is cool. As an arm chair route finding tool it becomes a highly addictive game. Its true that you can write on and compile your own maps from USGS printed maps, but the ability to scrawl and label all over a map and still have a clean copy is nice. And how many times have I hiked across a map and 3 inches into another, forcing me to pack an extra map. The sad part is I already bought 1/2 the state in 7 minute maps before I bought Topo. Hmm, no cpy protection on my cd's. I'm pretty rough on my maps so it's only a matter of time before some resemble parchment. I still favor a good ol compass, map, altimeter combo in the field

[Board In The Eye]

Geek God, don't you in fact use Topo! yourself?

[-lol-]

[Geek God]

Hey Board, yup I do use Topo, and think it's the cat's meow. Was just ranting about wilderness techno gadgets. It's been a few weeks since I had a good rant and wanted to stir up trouble! I don't care for the 3D stuff on Topo. Rather just see the flat maps. What I don't understand is people staring at their toys on top a summit on a nice sunny day, showing everybody their pictures on their one inch screens, or analyzing all the data they have on board. Well, gotta go hop in the 4x4 and drive home from work in style, see ya! BTW, got some awesome "toys" for Christmas, but not hiking related. Woo hoo!! yee-haw!! Hey BTW #2, don't trust the mileage on Topo. It's ok for the shift-mode straight lines. But other lines seem to be off by a lot, at least compared to Geektails maps. Maybe Greentrails is off? But it's ballpark and better'n nothing. I really like printing the maps that spill over map boundaries too. Awesome feature. Compass, altimeter, and printed Topo! map is a great combo for navigatin'. BTW #3: tip for abandoned trails enthusiasts: check out the smaller scale maps on Topo, which are way out-of-date 100,000:1 scale maps. Data from the 50's or earlier, and some really cool finds in there. Blow up to 200% scale, trace the olde trailles with route tool, and display on 7.5' map. Voila! Instant (slightly inaccurate but better than blank forest) olde traille data.

[The bear necessities]

Geek God, maybe you could use some of your powers to remedy the situation. Usually when I'm on a summit or at a lake, the fanciest thing I have is a Pargetter map. It makes a crinkly sound when you open it, but otherwise is pretty quiet. It relies on the reflective properties of light for me to read it but other than that is low tech. Having techno gadgets to tell you where you are, or perhaps where you aren't might be useful. I just upgraded to an LED flashlight. I had shied away from them for along time because I thought a LED flashlight would have an element of heaviness to it. Actually it is surprisingly light. But that is what I bought it for.