[Tsolo]

Comments on the Middle Fork plan are due to the Forest Service by May 8th. I don't want the road closed beyond Dingford Creek and thus don't want Alternative E. Can anyone who has waded through the NFS report on the web provide an opinion among the other four alternatives? In my comments to the NFS, I also want to make the point that although I'm a member of WTA, ALPS, Sierra Club, and Audubon, NONE of these organizations polled their members to solicit inputs prior to their boards making recommendations for Alternative E. And, in encouraging their members to support Alternative E, none of the organizations has provided to the members any details or discussion of the other alternatives. Does this bother you too?

[MtnGoat]

I'm not surprised. These supposed grass roots organizations are not that way at all. At the WTA their stance is decided by the operating board and that's that. The Sierra club is exactly the same way on many issues.

[Stefan]

Here is my take on what is going to happen. They will gate the road at Dingford and do nothing else because by the time the Forest Service wants to implement all those “things” they will give the excuse and say they won’t have any money. The only reason why the Forest Service will put up a gate is because it is a cheap thing to do. The Forest Service will have a key to open the gate at Dingford for the Goldmeyer people and for “special others”. Do you know who one of those “special others” will be? The WTA. That’s right. The WTA will support the recommendation for a gate at Dingford but then will turn around and solicit the Forest Service for a key to use the road.

[REJ]

None of the nonprofits that I am aware are democratic in any sense of the word. Most if all not nonprofits including the WTA, PNTA, etc are run by a board of directors. The day to day operation of the nonprofits is run by an executive director hired by the board. You can became a member of the board if you give alot of money or get involved. WTA can claim to represent 5000(?) hikers in Washington because that many people pay dues to be members. Work on the MFS plan has been ongoing by the FS and and various user and environmental groups for at least 8 years. The FS would not precede without the agreement of these organizations. The plan will stand unless there is an overwelming negative response from the public. Make sure to send you comments to the FS whether you agree or disagree with the proposed plan. Good luck!

[Mike Collins]

Stefan is right on with his prediction. You can bet that someone who pontificates about the virtues of gating the road will have the access key. You will see 'em at the hot springs in their tricked out SUVs while ordinary schmoes get to hoof it or bike in.

[m&m]

check out www.middleforkroad.org

[Fork Head]

I suspect the public will be the real payers of the maint. projects even though the land holders are supposed to assume those cost beyond the gate on the road, after all, the fees that are collected will be targeted for trails, campgrounds, and other maint., but to get to them you'll have to walk the road, so the land holders will have an excuse to cry they are mainting the road for hikers and recreationalist...wonders never cease! Watch and see:

[Newt]

Anyone have an idea how far you can drive it right now? I'm not familiar with the area. Am thinking of taking the juant this weekend to see what it's all about if I can find the time. Just seems a shame. I think by putting up a gate all they are gaining is no maint of the road. Any garabage will just be dumped at the gate. How much would it cost to grade it once a month or two? If the inholders want it maintained, let them maintain it. And to think that only the special interest groups have special privelages sucks. Only those at the top will have the key. It's funny how the gov't works. One hand takes away from you and the other takes from you. Tax payers take it in the shorts twice. You buy it, pay for it and you can't have it. NN

[-lol-]

[Pratt buff]

I looked at middleforkroad.org. Bunch of freeloading miners who want the public to pay to maintain the MF road so they can blast our mountains for minerals. That’s the American way – get the public to pay for your private gain. If they want the road maintained, then they can damn well pay for it.

[MCaver]

Getting the public to pay for private gain -- indeed the American Way. Timber companies get the FS to use taxpayer money to build roads, so they can harvest the timber for almost no out of pocket cost and sell it at market value. The public gets nothing but a large chunk of land that looks like #@%!$ and a road that will eventually be discontinued because the FS got next to nothing from the sale and can't afford to maintain it. Why would mining be any different?

[MtnGoat]

"The public gets nothing but a large chunk of land" I like lumber. I use it all the time, and it's renewable. A tree standing in a tree farm is of no use to me, neither is a cut down one. I need it cut, delimbed, debarked, sawed, sized, and transported for me. I'm happy to pay for someone else to increase it's value to me in that manner. I get something from logging, lumber.

[polarbear]

I think the WTA does alot of good, but I would be more inclined to be a member if I had more of a vote in its stances on wilderness issues. I think the real question is how much weight should an organization which is not democratic be given vs. the individual who writes to the FS about what they want done with the Middle Fork. If three organizations say they want Plan E, but 100 people write in favor of a different plan, which one should win? I suspect I know which one will win. You would have to have a fairly massive grassroots campaign to beat out a decision that has perhaps been made by perhaps only a handful of individuals from the nonprofit groups.

[Backpacker Joe]

If the road IS gated, there WILL be a trail PUNCHED around it so that the PUBLIC (who fund the forest service) can use the God Damned thing! TB

[MCaver]

Ok, Chris, you like lumber. I fail to see how that justifies the current FS practice mentioned above. There are other sources of lumber than public land, and certainly better ways to handle private use of it, extraction or not.