[newdawnfades]

I wonder how our season would have turned out thus far had we picked a Miguel Tejada or Vlad Guerrero. Losing Cameron seemed to be a big mistake.

[MooseAndSquirrel]

Talk to the frugal ownership about that. But at least we have nice guys who make funny commercials. Alan is correcto- a crappy season with dwindling attendance (a la Cleveland-remember when Jacobs Field sold out every game for the first few seasons after it opened?) might make the ownership wake up. We are following the exact same pattern of the Indians after their new stadium opened- once a playoff-caliber team with many star players- can you name one Indian player now except for ancient Omar who they tried to dump on the M's? The M's sellout on weekends only because all those seats were bought up before the season began when expectations were high and weekend games are always the most popular anyway. Every weeknight game is 25,000 now tops- which happens to be the season ticket holder number. No walk-ups. Next season's attendance will be the true barometer of what fans are feeling about the team's direction. The good thing about a sucky year is maybe all these young studs down on the farm can be called up and given extensive playing time. M's mgt.- don't be foolish and insult the fans by bankrupting the future by dealing away most of our valuable minor league talent in a fruitless attempt to "save" the season by aquiring some "name" player. What we really need is an out with the old and in with the new approach in the off-season.

[Alan Bauer]

Sweet---I didn't even know we played a day game today (you see, the ticks and rattlesnakes of the east side have me so scared I don't even track M's baseball close enough any longer.......) Franklin and M's give up only ONE run in a great pitched game!!!! M'S LOSE!!!!!!!!!! 1-0. Can't get any more consistant than that---give the team credit for consistency. Geez..........

[Sore Feet]

First step is gonna have to be to get the bullpen back to 2001 form. Dump Myers, send Shiggy down to Tacoma until he gets his stuff back (and if he doesn't trade him), and promote a couple of the newbies. They ain't gonna do much worse. Next, lets bring up some of the AAA bats that were hot in ST. Bocachica and Strong particularly. McCracken has been completely useless. And then we need to see some REALLY ballsy actions this year before the trade deadline. Let's go after Soriano for crying out loud! We've got TONS of pitching prospects, and Texas is supposedly weak on pitching (yet they somehow are doing better than Oakland, so maybe that assumption is out the window). So.....uh. Go Redsox!

[Alan Bauer]

The M's need to suck it up and trade away "some of the stars" to unload $$$, unload old age, and free up room to let the young guys to play---and get new young talent for the trades too.

[#19]

We had 9 strong years. It was a great run. But not much in sports last forever, unless you are the Yanks or the Lakers. And even they have down years. Just the way it goes. The question is, will ownership do anything to rebuild quickly?

[MooseAndSquirrel]

Yes, but it's all the could-have-beens and missed opportunities of not taking the plunge and risking a big aquisition(s) like a lot of other teams that stings. I don't count signing free agents the caliber of Jeff Cirillo or Heathcliff Slocum as bold moves do you? There seemed to be countless times when just a bold move at the right time could have put us over the top but the ownership balked (Yeah, a baseball term har har). Just like the region's reluctance to make any big moves like investing in real mass transit instead of goofy second-rate options like rebuilding the Viaduct or building a monorail initially on the wrong axis of north-south instead of east-west and other meek little gestures rather than the bold moves of hosting a world's fair or starting up a little air mail service long ago,etc., everybody around here be it sports owner or politician or voter is too damn conservative too much of the time!!!

[polarbear]

Everyone meditate on the following word: Argyros

[MooseAndSquirrel]

That was before we had E-X-P-E-C-T-A-T-I-O-N-S. (Whew that was hard to do). Hell, you could park for nuthin' 2 blocks away from the Kingdome, sit anywhere your little fanny cared in the 300 level for $1.50!, spend maybe three times that on food and drink, watch the Good Ship Mariner raise up from behind the outfield wall, shake your head at the butt-ugly brown usher uniforms, enjoy a slugfest invariably, and go home not feeling like you've been gouged out a new fecal orifice. Hey, and every once in awhile a big moment would occur like Gaylord Perry's 300th win or Nolan Ryan's last game or Roger Clemen's striking out 20 M's- such a deal! Maybe what we have now is just a big fancy illusion of success- oooh a pretty stadium!, nice restrooms!, a big team store!, escalators! Lots of food and drink choices!..... $20 parking right next door! $9 for a beer! $5 for a hotdog! Over $150 for a family of 4 for a day at the old ballgame! This is a huge improvement!

[touron]

I do not have high expectations for the Mariners. Win a few and provide some cheap entertainment, that's what it's all about. There's nothing like the view from the cheap seats. Hey! Wait! Did I say cheap?? Four tickets, four hotdogs, four soft drinks for $50. You just have to know where to shop... So in summary, if everyone lowers their expectations a bit, then we won't be paying players $100's of millions of dollars salaries, then tickets come down in price, and then more people that never go to games might start going, people like the Nordic Princess and Miss Normandy, because now they can afford tickets. Wouldn't you be more likely to go to a game if you knew you had a chance of sitting next to one of them? Remember less (as in expectations) is more! The slogan is "we don't give a rip!" The slogan is "Don't give us the penant, just give us some cheap entertainment!" Let capitalism serve the people and not vice versa. Thank you, Touron

[Toonces]

newdawnfades, I miss Cameron too. As an east-coast transplant, it was very hard being in the stands on Sunday when they blew the 6 run lead to the Yankees. That said, I still have a great time whenever I go to the ballpark!

[-lol-]

[borank]

It’s easy to blame the Mariner front office for lack of success, but the bottom line is that 29 teams go home unhappy at the end of every season. You have to be good, and lucky. The Mariners have had some bad luck with acquisitions. Cirillo should have been a great pickup with a career .311 avg over 8 seasons. Al Martin should have been solid with a .282 avg over 9 seasons including a .306 avg in SD when the M’s picked him up. Both guys came over from the NL and had much less success in the AL. That’s probably what we’re seeing with Aurilia right now, and why I’m not too crazy about NL pickups. Heathcliff Slocumb is a perfect example of giving up too much for too little. The talent the M’s gave up to compete in ’95 and ’97 is the reason they didn’t challenge again until 2000, when they finally got some players and money back for Johnson and Griffey. When you talk about trading away players that aren’t playing well right now, are you thinking there are other major league teams that don’t know that? About all that could be done is to trade your crappy players for their crappy players. IMO, the Mariners had their best chance in 2000 and got robbed in the ALCS. In game 4 (I think) at Safeco, Roger Clemens knocked A-Rod down on 2 consecutive pitches in the 1st inning and didn’t even get a warning. Imagine what would have happened if Freddie had thrown two consecutive pitches at Jeter’s or William’s head at Yankee Stadium! Clemens went on to dominate the game, pitching liberally on the inside. He should have been issued a warning after the 2nd knockdown, which leads to an automatic ejection on any subsequent too close inside pitches. The game would have changed significantly since the Yankees didn’t have another reliable pitcher to bring in for long relief if Clemens was ejected. In game 6 at Yankee Stadium, the Mariners were leading in the 7th. With 2 outs, 2 on and Rhodes pitching to Justice, Justice offered at a 2-2 pitch, but it was ruled a check-swing. The replay clearly showed the bat trailed out over the plate. Instead of being out of the inning, Justice knocked the 3-2 pitch into the stands. There were several more calls that went against the Mariners in that series. They say those things even out in the long run, but they sure didn’t in the 2000 ALCS.

[Sore Feet]

[Lead Dog]

Ya know somethin? Where else can you get the QUALITY disscusion that we get here on this forum? I just needed a break from the War, Beheading, Naked twister pictures, US Army porno, so I ask a question, Do the Mariners suck? and look at the response I get. I may not agree with many of you on this board , but I'd hike with any one of ya! What we have here is knowledgeable Mariners fans. And by the way. I agree with ALL of you!! Thanks again. The Lead Dog