Forum Index > Full Moon Saloon > Road Trips, EVs, & Range Anxiety Questions
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iron
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iron
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PostThu Nov 10, 2022 8:32 pm 
we drove from kimberley, bc, to seattle, and then back over the course of 9 days. travel through canada via hwy 3 was mostly a breeze. seattle was fine. i-90 back to spokane was a crapshoot. i couldn't believe it. so many out of service charging stations. our chevy bolt doesn't charge very fast compared to others, but it was still fine and doable. no, we're not busting ass like stefan to get to snowbird, but you gotta understand the use of your vehicle. 98% of our travel is fine even with 120v charging at home. road trips involve planning and patience. i think our total charges for our trip was something like $60 for 1200 miles. we have found many free level 2 chargers throughout southern BC.

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Bosterson
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PostThu Nov 10, 2022 8:41 pm 
neek wrote:
While I'd rather see subsidies go to ebikes for everyone vs. luxury cars for a few, I'll take what I can get.
It's not luxury cars, it's luxury incomes. The tax credit is refundable, meaning you need to owe $7500 in income tax in the first place to claim the full credit. They need to turn it into a nonrefundable credit so that it could be a functional incentive for low income people who commute to work, taking those gas cars off the road. People with low incomes just don't owe enough tax for the current credit to do much to offset the premium they'd pay for an EV, it's asinine.

Go! Take a gun! And a dog! Without a leash! Chop down a tree! Start a fire! Piss wherever you want! Build a cairn! A HUGE ONE! BE A REBEL! YOU ONLY LIVE ONCE! (-bootpathguy)
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neek
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PostThu Nov 10, 2022 9:58 pm 
Bosterson wrote:
It's not luxury cars, it's luxury incomes. The tax credit is refundable, meaning you need to owe $7500 in income tax in the first place to claim the full credit. They need to turn it into a nonrefundable credit so that it could be a functional incentive for low income people who commute to work, taking those gas cars off the road. People with low incomes just don't owe enough tax for the current credit to do much to offset the premium they'd pay for an EV, it's asinine.
Hmm we might need some more precise definitions to have a real discussion, but in my mind a "low income person" can't afford a brand new car in the $40-$80K range (and since there's no official definition of "luxury", it can be whatever I want). They could take out a loan so the government is really just paying some of the interest on that (likely predatory) loan which, please, no. I don't want the government encouraging people to buy stuff they don't need and can't afford, we already have enough of that. Also, since even without the incentive we can't come close to meeting the world's current EV demands, is the incentive really more than a handout to the auto industry? (Well, to be fair, it's also about moving jobs to the US, which is a good thing.) Anyway the point was that if you are like me and thinking of buying one in a few years (because they're cool, not because you have some mistaken notion of them significantly reducing emissions), all hope is not yet lost for claiming the credit.

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Randito
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PostThu Nov 10, 2022 10:27 pm 
Many of BEV on the market day are Tesla emulators , high power , high range, a gazillion features. The acceleration of even a standard Model 3 is amazing. The performance has definitely been a factor in Tesla sales to various tech bros. It would be interesting to see what could be done NEVs ( Nieghborhood Electric Vehicles) These have made some inroads in Europe and are exploding in China. I think wider adoption in the US market would be facilitated by an updated standard with a maximum speed of 35 from 25 mph.

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Schroder
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PostFri Nov 11, 2022 6:25 am 
neek wrote:
it also comes with an assembled-in-US requirement that makes pretty much everyone but Tesla and Chevy (and Rivian...been seeing a lot of those around here) ineligible.
VW is now made in Tennessee and there are 23 others - Audi, BMW, Chrysler, Ford, GMC, Jeep, Lincoln, Nissan, Rivian, Tesla, and Volvo made in the U.S.

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Route Loser
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PostFri Nov 11, 2022 7:04 pm 
Long live the Bolt! Unfortunately if you take the time to read the Inflation Reduction Act, you may come to the conclusion that congress needs a merciless editor. It's messy and sometimes vague. The sketchy parts are left up to the IRS and Treasury to provide guidance on implementation. The best anyone can do regarding the various tax credits at this point is to speculate. Speculating on the renamed Clean Vehicle Credit: Barring the passage of additional legislation, starting in 2023, for a person shopping among the 20-some vehicles that may meet the Final Assembly in North America requirement, the most likely tax credit received will be $0. The credit has been split into 2 halves. One half requires 40% battery components assembled in North America. The second half requires 40% of battery critical minerals to be extracted or processed in countries with which the U.S. has a free trade agreement (or sourced from North American recycling). GM CEO speculating that their vehicles will receive half of the credit in '23. A tidy list of bullet points with the credit requirements, and Ford CEO speculating that some of their vehicles will receive half of the credit in '23. Tesla seems likely to be first to produce a vehicle eligible for the full tax credit, but is somewhat unlikely to do so in '23. Rivian and most other manufacturers are unlikely to produce a vehicle eligible for any credit in '23. Some may surprise if they (or their battery supplier) quickly retool sourcing and assembly to bifurcate their model lineup into some with batteries that meet requirements and the rest that don't. There are no battery requirements for the commercial vehicle tax credit, so we can expect to see at least some of this creative assembly happening in regard to pickups sold as fleet vehicles. There are new income limits and vehicle price limits. The vehicle price limits for crossovers will hinge on whether they are classified as cars or SUVs. With some restrictions, used EVs will be eligible for a $4,000 credit in '23, which should provide a greater benefit to the mass of the people. The EV tax credits should always have been refundable, or at least able to be carried forward, but the new law does provide a better option for consumers. Starting in 2024, we should see the credit become a rebate applied at the point of sale (technically a tax credit transferred from the consumer to the dealership). This is probably open to a lot of interpretation from the IRS, and will need to be implemented in partnership with state governments. We can hope this is a benefit that allows everyone (unless their income is too high) to receive the full discount on their EV purchase price. We will pray there is some oversight so this does not end up with the dealerships simply pocketing the credit, without any price reduction for the consumer, as is somewhat common practice currently with leased vehicles.

Bosterson
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