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Snowshovel
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PostSat Oct 22, 2022 3:29 pm 
Josh Lewis, RumiDude
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RumiDude
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PostSat Oct 22, 2022 3:51 pm 
From the article: "WDFW said the woman was attacked at a residence adjacent to Enchantment Park and Blackbird Island in Leavenworth at around 7 a.m." Wowsers, that's right smack in town! Rumi

"This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all."
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Get Out and Go
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PostSat Oct 22, 2022 4:09 pm 
The mom and her 2 cubs have been frequenting the neighborhood adjacent to Blackbird Island for a while. My wife and son saw them a month ago while on a walk. Shame they couldn't have moved the family far away before it came to this. They became habituated to human trash.

"These are the places you will find me hiding'...These are the places I will always go." (Down in the Valley by The Head and The Heart) "Sometimes you're happy. Sometimes you cry. Half of me is ocean. Half of me is sky." (Thanks, Tom Petty)

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kiliki
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PostSun Oct 23, 2022 9:07 am 
Relocation is not the “silver bullet” to resolving human-bear conflicts. Although it seems to be favoured by bear control agencies and the general public, current research suggests that adult bears almost always return to their former ranges and generally do so within a month, regardless of the distance they are moved. (Landriault 1998) https://www.bearsmart.com/managing-bears/relocation/

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treeswarper
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PostMon Oct 24, 2022 8:31 pm 
Sounds like dur bavarian willage needs to work on a more bear proof trash method. One place I lived had dumpsters for our neighborhood in an enclosure surrounded by a 6 foot high chain link fence, with plywood reenforcing the lower part, and an electric fence wire on top. The trouble was that some people failed to close the gate after putting garbage in. Otherwise it worked and I took refuge inside the enclosure when I encountered a bear sleeping nearby. My dog woke the bear up and chased it out of the area.

What's especially fun about sock puppets is that you can make each one unique and individual, so that they each have special characters. And they don't have to be human––animals and aliens are great possibilities
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Randito
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PostTue Oct 25, 2022 9:40 am 
https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2006/08/security_is_a_t.html
Quote:
Said one park ranger, “There is considerable overlap between the intelligence of the smartest bears and the dumbest tourists.”

Noheaperture, Bootpathguy, Downhill, Anne Elk, Snowdog  IanB
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treeswarper
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PostTue Oct 25, 2022 9:48 am 
Randito wrote:
https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2006/08/security_is_a_t.html
Quote:
Said one park ranger, “There is considerable overlap between the intelligence of the smartest bears and the dumbest tourists.”
The article used is too simple. I will point out that some of the bear proof garbage containers are extremely difficult to operate. I think they've been damaged from the garbage trucks tipping, or run into by cars, or need shots of WD40. If you want people to use things, make them easy to use. As I'm getting older, child proof containers are getting harder to open. In the 1980s, I looked at the recycling dumpsters here and thought they'd be very hard for old people to use. Now that I'm an old people, I can tell you that is true. The same dumpsters are being used today. Make things that are easy, but still meet the purpose.

What's especially fun about sock puppets is that you can make each one unique and individual, so that they each have special characters. And they don't have to be human––animals and aliens are great possibilities
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bccarlso
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PostTue Oct 25, 2022 11:25 am 
At some apartments I used to live in on the Keweenaw Peninsula (Northern part of the Upper Peninsula), we had a resident bear who we'd see just about every night come and filter through the dumpsters outside. It was kind of fun as a kid back then to see, but in hindsight is pretty bad! I wonder if they ended up putting it down.

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zephyr
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PostTue Oct 25, 2022 1:06 pm 
treeswarper wrote:
Make things that are easy, but still meet the purpose.
Exactly. ~z

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Randito
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PostTue Oct 25, 2022 2:51 pm 
treeswarper wrote:
Randito wrote:
https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2006/08/security_is_a_t.html
Quote:
Said one park ranger, “There is considerable overlap between the intelligence of the smartest bears and the dumbest tourists.”
The article used is too simple. I will point out that some of the bear proof garbage containers are extremely difficult to operate. I think they've been damaged from the garbage trucks tipping, or run into by cars, or need shots of WD40. If you want people to use things, make them easy to use. As I'm getting older, child proof containers are getting harder to open. In the 1980s, I looked at the recycling dumpsters here and thought they'd be very hard for old people to use. Now that I'm an old people, I can tell you that is true. The same dumpsters are being used today. Make things that are easy, but still meet the purpose.
I think the general problem is balancing the convience for humans to use while making it suffiently challenging for the bears. Drunk, lazy, physically limited and just plain dumb humans will only put so much effort into figuring out and operating a "bear proof" garbage container before giving up and leaving their garage beside the garbage container, where it's easy pickings for bears, crows, raccoons and rats.

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Lazyhiker
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PostTue Oct 25, 2022 2:52 pm 
kiliki wrote:
Relocation is not the “silver bullet” to resolving human-bear conflicts. Although it seems to be favoured by bear control agencies and the general public, current research suggests that adult bears almost always return to their former ranges and generally do so within a month, regardless of the distance they are moved. (Landriault 1998) https://www.bearsmart.com/managing-bears/relocation/
The adult female bear was euthanized shortly after the attack. The lady said she never saw it coming, she’s doing well and she’s very lucky.

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treeswarper
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PostTue Oct 25, 2022 4:41 pm 
Randito wrote:
Drunk, lazy, physically limited and just plain dumb humans will only put so much effort into figuring out and operating a "bear proof" garbage container before giving up and leaving their garage beside the garbage container, where it's easy pickings for bears, crows, raccoons and rats.
If the design is too complicated, it will not be used properly, if at all. What part of simple is hard to understand? I'm not going to spend an hour or even less, trying to figure out how to get a stubborn, poorly designed piece of iron open. In case you wonder, I took a large hammer to a gate one time. I got it open.

What's especially fun about sock puppets is that you can make each one unique and individual, so that they each have special characters. And they don't have to be human––animals and aliens are great possibilities
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Ski
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PostTue Oct 25, 2022 5:18 pm 
^ There is no reason to make the latch complicated. it only has to be able to prevent the bear from being able to get purchase on it either with its claws or its teeth. It's because of that they have to be built with fairly tight joints - if the bear can get his claws into a hinge, or between the door and the body, they're getting in. It's well documented that bears in California State Park have removed doors from automobiles in instances where they were able to get claws in between the vehicle door and the body (or door pillars.) How are the trash receptacles in downtown Juneau faring?

"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach. I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
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Randito
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PostTue Oct 25, 2022 5:31 pm 
treeswarper wrote:
Randito wrote:
Drunk, lazy, physically limited and just plain dumb humans will only put so much effort into figuring out and operating a "bear proof" garbage container before giving up and leaving their garage beside the garbage container, where it's easy pickings for bears, crows, raccoons and rats.
If the design is too complicated, it will not be used properly, if at all. What part of simple is hard to understand? I'm not going to spend an hour or even less, trying to figure out how to get a stubborn, poorly designed piece of iron open. In case you wonder, I took a large hammer to a gate one time. I got it open.
The core issue is motivation -- people are just trying to dispose of their garbage -- maybe it's raining and they are in their house slippers -- anything that takes more than 5 seconds to figure out it too much. A bear on the other hand can smell the food in the garbage container and is willing to spent hours figuring out how to go dumpster diving. https://www.kqed.org/news/11687093/a-brief-history-of-bear-proofing-in-yosemite-from-canisters-to-a-garbage-dump

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Chief Joseph
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PostTue Oct 25, 2022 7:56 pm 
Ski wrote:
^ There is no reason to make the latch complicated. it only has to be able to prevent the bear from being able to get purchase on it either with its claws or its teeth. It's because of that they have to be built with fairly tight joints - if the bear can get his claws into a hinge, or between the door and the body, they're getting in. It's well documented that bears in California State Park have removed doors from automobiles in instances where they were able to get claws in between the vehicle door and the body (or door pillars.) How are the trash receptacles in downtown Juneau faring?
Right? Did you see the photo I posted a while back of a BP trash receptacle on Priest lake that was pulled from the foundation and ripped open to access the trash inside? Likely a Griz...but the underlying reason for that incident was lack of timely trash removal.

Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof.
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