Forum Index > Full Moon Saloon > New baseball rules rule.
 Reply to topic
Previous :: Next Topic
Author Message
Slugman
Itís a Slugfest!



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 16800 | TRs | Pics
Slugman
Itís a Slugfest!
PostSun Apr 09, 2023 12:32 pm 
I like the new rules. I never liked the shift. And I do like the stolen base. Trying to score one run makes sense as a strategy if it is more likely to happen. The pitch clock/hitterís clock has really changed the feel of the game. But it has gone a little to far. New batters coming to the plate should have more time than the time in between pitches. 5 extra seconds, Iím thinking. And the anticipation has been diminished in close games like last night. There is something unique to baseball in the mind game between pitcher, catcher and batter. Itís the third inning? OK, move it along, awesome. Two outs in the ninth in a one run game like last night? No! It feels wrong. The pitch/hitter clock should be off in the ninth inning of close games ( two runs). They trimmed 20 + minutes of fat from every game, but they trimmed into the meat in a couple of spots IMO. Now, robot umpires, and we will have something!

Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
GaliWalker
Have camera will use



Joined: 10 Dec 2007
Posts: 4779 | TRs | Pics
Location: Pittsburgh
GaliWalker
Have camera will use
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 8:54 am 
Slugman wrote:
I never liked the shift.
I'm not in favor of contrived, overly complicated rules that have been tacked on as Band-Aids to fix some niche issue. Exhibit A: The shift. No way should it have been outlawed. Fielders should be allowed to stand anywhere. Batters can't hit to the opposite field...? Learn, or get out of the game. It's not as if hitting to opposite field isn't the easier way to get a hit; you have more time. Homers, obviously, are another matter. All these batters want to hit home runs, and only home runs - that's what their stroke is geared to do - but, in my opinion, a better hitter is one who isn't a one-trick pony. One other thing about the shift: it allows for more innovation. e.g. You can have the pitcher attack the far side of the plate more and load an extra fielder in opposite field, and vice versa. I like the pitch clock, however - to me, it feels like a more general rule - but agree with you that they may have gone too far in the other direction.

'Gali'Walker => 'Mountain-pass' walker bobbi: "...don't you ever forget your camera!" Photography: flickr.com/photos/shahiddurrani

trestle
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
kiliki
Member
Member


Joined: 07 Apr 2003
Posts: 2171 | TRs | Pics
Location: Seattle
kiliki
Member
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 9:44 am 
I think 18 seconds would be better than 15. I also don't want it in the 9th though have heard baseball people say you can't have different rules for different innings, and I get that. Imagine losing a big game to a pitch clock violation in the 9th, though. I didn't think anything was wrong with the length of games but OTOH having been to weeknight games already this year, I didn't hate being home by 10.

Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
Sculpin
Member
Member


Joined: 23 Apr 2015
Posts: 1251 | TRs | Pics
Sculpin
Member
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 10:28 am 
GaliWalker wrote:
I'm not in favor of contrived, overly complicated rules that have been tacked on as Band-Aids to fix some niche issue
Yep, same with pro basketball outlawing zone defense with goofy rules about where the defenders have to be standing. When I was in high school we had a very clever coach who spent weeks teaching us schemes to set picks inside zone defenses - something you never see - which led to an undersized team winning some games it had no business winning. Isn't that what sports is supposed to be about?
GaliWalker wrote:
Batters can't hit to the opposite field...? Learn, or get out of the game.
I agree. Listening to Freddy Freeman whine about how he spent all those years perfecting the art of pulling the ball...I'm pretty sure I could hear the world's tiniest violin playing in the background. clown.gif Nothing was more fun during the shift era than watching a mediocre hitter like Ji-Man Choi getting pitched outside with a full shift and then slapping a fungo towards third base with nobody there.

Between every two pines is a doorway to the new world. - John Muir

GaliWalker
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
Slugman
Itís a Slugfest!



Joined: 27 Mar 2003
Posts: 16800 | TRs | Pics
Slugman
Itís a Slugfest!
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 1:13 pm 
Canít agree. The shift was a disaster for baseball. Fans were taking your advice and leaving the game. So, lets have freedom of player positioning in a game thatís dying. No thanks. Playing for home runs but getting lots more strikeouts is boring baseball, and millions of people have voted with their wallets and eyeballs and rear ends. Complicated rules? The shift ban is simple. And artificial? You mean like every single rule in baseball?

Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
Chief Joseph
Member
Member


Joined: 10 Nov 2007
Posts: 7173 | TRs | Pics
Location: Verlot-Priest Lake
Chief Joseph
Member
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 1:49 pm 
Haven't watched a game yet so not sure how the news rules have impacted the game. I am a bit of a purist, so I don't really like any changes, I don't like the DH and I'm not even sure I like inter-league play. The DH removed a lot of strategy from the game and led to more players swinging for the fences, which I don't like. Comparable to the NBA which to me because of all the 3 pointers and one on one play has become nearly unwatchable to me. As for the shift, I can understand arguments on both sides. Football has limitations on formations so maybe that's a good thing. I do agree that a professional player should be able to hit the ball to all fields. I don't like the larger bases because again, I am a purist. I do like the pitch clock idea but also agree that they might have gone a bit too far with it, but I imagine that they will tweak it going forward. I think umpires should continue to call balls and strikes, it would be sad to remove that human element from the game, too much automation in the world already. I do wish that we could go back in time and have no more than a 100 game season, 162, imo, is just plain ridiculous. I think the reason is that back when the game began, it was more of a full time job than a sport.

Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof.

Slugman
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
borank
Lake dork



Joined: 16 Dec 2001
Posts: 628 | TRs | Pics
Location: Evert
borank
Lake dork
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 2:22 pm 
I suppose I have a lower threshold for getting bored by seeing the same things over and over. I followed the Mariners somewhat avidly from the early 80s 'til about 5 years ago. Finally got tired of batters stepping out of the box between every pitch to readjust their batting gloves, pitchers shaking off four or five signs, then stepping off the rubber, or throwing over to first base a couple times between pitches, 2/3s of league seemingly pull hitters hitting into a shift, batters being rung up on pitches that are in a different zip code from home plate, inability to lay down a bunt to advance runners. For the M's as a team, I've seen enough of inability to manufacture a run with a runner on and no outs, a roster with 4 or less players (total) at or above the league average for OBP and SLG. Sabermetrics has been a curse with maybe a little blessing. It's is the antithesis of traditional purist baseball. Too many pitching changes to achieve head to head matchups, esp. when the new pitcher doesn't make the pitches they need to. Any rule changes to improve the flow of the game are good for me. I'm especially a fan of umpires not being part of the outcome of a game. The technology exist for robotic ball and strike calls - I hope they seriously consider incorporating it.

Slugman
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
GaliWalker
Have camera will use



Joined: 10 Dec 2007
Posts: 4779 | TRs | Pics
Location: Pittsburgh
GaliWalker
Have camera will use
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 2:54 pm 
Slugman wrote:
Complicated rules? The shift ban is simple. And artificial? You mean like every single rule in baseball?
Here's the (relevant part of the) rule:
Quote:
Beginning in 2023, teams no longer will be allowed to have more than two infielders on one side of second base.
Seems pretty contrived to me. And no, not every rule in baseball is artificial. There's usually a good reason for them; much better than one that protects one-dimensional hitters. Yes, even for the in-field fly rule. And are we sure this rule was the reason fans were leaving in droves? Maybe. I confess that hitters continuously hitting into the shift was pretty aggravating to me. However, is the solution to stifle any little bit of innovation by making a rule against it? Shouldn't the offense adjust instead? Tactics and innovation interest me more than my aggravation with a myopic/stupid/dare-I-say-poor hitter continually hitting into the shift, when there are acres of grass on the opposite field. Here's an analogy from the most popular sport in America, football*: Instead of whining for a rule to outlaw the blitz, a well-rounded quarterback/offense has the ability to use it against the defense. * I realize that pulling a counterexample from football - a sport full of complicated and contrived rules - wasn't the wisest move! embarassedlaugh.gif

'Gali'Walker => 'Mountain-pass' walker bobbi: "...don't you ever forget your camera!" Photography: flickr.com/photos/shahiddurrani
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
Chief Joseph
Member
Member


Joined: 10 Nov 2007
Posts: 7173 | TRs | Pics
Location: Verlot-Priest Lake
Chief Joseph
Member
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 3:15 pm 
If they replace umpires with robots I doubt that I will watch another game. The human error of umpires in the long run will have equal advantages and disadvantages to every team. Itís kinda like blackjack players blaming the 3rd base player when their strategical errors cause them to lose the hand. Their play can both benefit and be a detriment to the other players equally. I would probably watch more baseball but I have DISH network and I would have to pay extra to watch Mís games, really? As I said, imo the MLB season is much too long so I am rarely interested until near seasons end and into the playoffs.

Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof.
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
Pyrites
Member
Member


Joined: 16 Sep 2014
Posts: 1766 | TRs | Pics
Location: South Sound
Pyrites
Member
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 3:24 pm 
Pitch clock. Yep. Been watching it at Tacoma for a couple years. Forgotten with shifting base syndrome is that 2:20 and 2:35 games were the norm in the Ď60ís. Ball players got paid millions, and socially could ignore home umps telling them to stay in the box, and not wander around between pitches. That and fussing with batting gloves. Big fan of this change. Shift? It was a tactic that worked. Even with max non-shift shift hitters who canít hit opposite field are getting left behind. None(?) have learned to consistently bunt hard down 3rd base line which seems obvious reaction. It took a generation of using the slap shot to bring up hockey players who had used it at Pee Wee and above to produce Bobby Orr. Plus his magical ability to skate backwards as well as most were skating forwards. Are coaches at the Little League, Babe Ruth, and high school levels pushing hitting around the field? It may be that we havenít seen the decade or two long response of developing the hitters that defeat the shift. You folks do know that at most games at AAA the computer is calling balls and strikes? Not sure, but I think throughout the minors. It was funny to see hitters turn around to disagree with the ump the first dozen games it was used. They ran it a year or two getting data and reliability before making the switch. People looked at every pitch. What they discovered, besides repeatability, was that human pitch callers created skewed, squashed ovoid pitch zones. The optics/computer creates a rectangular box the pitch needs to intersect at some point. Go Rainiers. PS. I still think weirdest in ball is the dropped 3rd strike, run it out to first rule. Actually saw a successful one at a home game last week.

Keep Calm and Carry On? Heck No. Stay Excited and Get Outside!

Slugman
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
Chief Joseph
Member
Member


Joined: 10 Nov 2007
Posts: 7173 | TRs | Pics
Location: Verlot-Priest Lake
Chief Joseph
Member
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 4:15 pm 
I think the NBA definitely needs robotic officials....where does it end? shakehead.gif It really is painful being a "Purist" seeing what has become of the game.

Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof.
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
Get Out and Go
Member
Member


Joined: 13 Nov 2004
Posts: 2086 | TRs | Pics
Location: Leavenworth
Get Out and Go
Member
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 6:59 pm 
Still canít get used to the man on 2nd base to begin extra innings. I leave the room for a moment, come back and think, ďOh wow, what did I miss?Ē huh.gif

"These are the places you will find me hiding'...These are the places I will always go." (Down in the Valley by The Head and The Heart) "Sometimes you're happy. Sometimes you cry. Half of me is ocean. Half of me is sky." (Thanks, Tom Petty)

GaliWalker, Slugman
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
Pyrites
Member
Member


Joined: 16 Sep 2014
Posts: 1766 | TRs | Pics
Location: South Sound
Pyrites
Member
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 7:28 pm 
Thatís another innovation thatís been trialed at the minor leagues. I donít like it for the same reason I donít like kicking for a goal to decide victor in soccer. Itís playing a different game to decide the winner. Might as well play a few hands of bridge to break the tie.

Keep Calm and Carry On? Heck No. Stay Excited and Get Outside!

Slugman
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
Chief Joseph
Member
Member


Joined: 10 Nov 2007
Posts: 7173 | TRs | Pics
Location: Verlot-Priest Lake
Chief Joseph
Member
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 7:50 pm 
Get Out and Go wrote:
Still canít get used to the man on 2nd base to begin extra innings. I leave the room for a moment, come back and think, ďOh wow, what did I miss?Ē huh.gif
Yes, that's just ridiculous and an abomination to the game. The game used to be so much better. I blame Steinbrenner and the lack of a salary cap for the beginning of the end, older fans will recall how he bought Super Teams by paying exorbitant salaries that small market teams could not afford. He single handily decimated the great Oakland A's teams of the 70's. Then they come up with the DH, more BS, if a player can't field their position, they should quit, retire or try harder. Imo, they are going to alienate just as many if not more fans than they gain by all these ridiculous changes. Professional sports, again imo, have gone completely to hell. The NBA also has this ridiculous play in thing where nearly every team is eligible for the post season. Then we have players bringing Politics into the games and alienating even more fans. Thank God for College basketball, about the only sport left worth watching....although I am not quite done with the NFL...yet. Later, I will tell y'all how I really feel. flammable.gif

Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof.
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
Chief Joseph
Member
Member


Joined: 10 Nov 2007
Posts: 7173 | TRs | Pics
Location: Verlot-Priest Lake
Chief Joseph
Member
PostMon Apr 10, 2023 8:13 pm 
I know many are against it but MLB really should have had a salary cap decades ago, like as I mentioned to stop the big market teams from stealing players from small market teams, essentially making them minor league franchises. They pay the players exorbitant salaries leading to ultra high ticket prices and forcing fans to pay extra over their already ridiculous cable tv bills just to be able to watch the games. Very poor decisions by the league and owners imo is what has led to the demise of baseball. The thing is that baseball, unlike faster sports is no where near as exciting to watch, except to fans with a real understanding of the complexities of the game. As I said before, the DH removed a lot of strategic maneuvers and decisions for the managers and allowed over the hill players that can't run or field to remain in the game. Plus as someone mentioned, bunting is also a lost art...again, not exciting to watch, (except when Ty Cobb did it) but was frequent strategic maneuver prior to everyone wanting to swing for the fences. You say, "who wants to watch pitchers hit?".....nearly anyone can become competent at bunting given enough practice, plus as I said that forces managers to make difficult decisions, whether or not to pinch hit for the pitcher, leave him in, etc.

Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof.
Back to top Reply to topic Reply with quote Send private message
   All times are GMT - 8 Hours
 Reply to topic
Forum Index > Full Moon Saloon > New baseball rules rule.
  Happy Birthday naturealbeing!
Jump to:   
Search this topic:

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum