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Bruce Albert
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Bruce Albert
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PostSat Apr 15, 2023 8:58 pm 
Kim Brown wrote:
Not sure exactly what they mean by "acceptably stored," but it might lead to bear canister req'ts in the future; this is in effect until April 15, 2025
Boy, I hate to be a poo-head and all, but with the utter neglect of road maintenance and repair across the forest...so often blamed on lack of funding, I'd love to know how much resources and hours of the meeting culture stuff like this sucks up. Yes, there are bears. Deal with it.

Joseph
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Randito
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PostSat Apr 15, 2023 9:08 pm 
zimmertr wrote:
Makes sense that the MidFork campgrounds got those bear boxes. Wasn't that area closed to camping and hiking at some point last year due to a problem bear? Maybe I'm misremembering?
You remember correctly https://www.king5.com/article/news/local/middle-fork-campground-snoqualmie-river-closes-forest-service-bears/281-871340e5-0b6a-4e07-9577-6f6712619d57 https://www.seattletimes.com/life/outdoors/bear-encounters-close-middle-fork-campground-other-campsites/

zimmertr
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BigBrunyon
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PostSat Apr 15, 2023 10:20 pm 
Im thinking it's probably because they know about a large number of grizz sightings that they are HIDING ffrom the public eye!! The government always hides the grizz sightings!!

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Kim Brown
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PostSat Apr 15, 2023 11:34 pm 
Bruce Albert wrote:
Yes, there are bears. Deal with it.
i'm looking at it as protection for the bears more than for protection of humans. habituated bears end up dead. if you look at it that way, maybe you'd like it better - I do!

"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area." Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert

The Ghost of Bear 380, zimmertr
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Randito
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PostSun Apr 16, 2023 8:25 am 
Kim Brown wrote:
Bruce Albert wrote:
Yes, there are bears. Deal with it.
i'm looking at it as protection for the bears more than for protection of humans. habituated bears end up dead. if you look at it that way, maybe you'd like it better - I do!
The steel bear caches make it much easier for people to securely store their food. So they do more reliably, which means the bears get fewer rewards for hanging around campsites. Steel food caches are pretty common in Canadian campgrounds. I had a conversation with Canadian park ranger in one park and where the steel caches had recently been installed and he said that they had had several incidents per season before prior to the steel boxes being installed, even with food hanging poles in the campsites. In the two years since the steel boxes were installed, no bear raids. I believe the black bear population has been growing in Washington. One indication is that the WDFW increased the per hunter annual limit from one to two recently. https://chewelahindependent.com/wdfw-changes-bear-hunting-rules-now-hunters-can-bag-two-bears-on-either-side-of-state/ In 2020 hunters reported taking about 2000 bears out of an estimated state population of 20,000 bears. If hunters are culling 10% of the population each year, those bears must be pretty frisky.

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Cyclopath
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Cyclopath
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PostSun Apr 16, 2023 11:19 am 

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Navy salad
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PostSun Apr 16, 2023 12:49 pm 
I just (on April 16) clicked on the original link and Exhibit B is now shown. One acceptable method is just using a bear hang at least 10' off the ground and 4' from the trunk. Of course, depending on the trees, that might be easier said than done:

The Ghost of Bear 380
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Joseph
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PostSun Apr 16, 2023 1:18 pm 
Bruce Albert wrote:
Boy, I hate to be a poo-head and all, but with the utter neglect of road maintenance and repair across the forest...so often blamed on lack of funding, I'd love to know how much resources and hours of the meeting culture stuff like this sucks up. Yes, there are bears. Deal with it.
Not to mention TH security. But spot on. Decisions made by bureaucrats in endless meetings. I used an Ursack on section J last year. I'll use it again. No way am I getting a bulky bear cannister that only holds some of my food anyway. I seriously doubt there's going to be a bunch of rangers on the lookout for illicit food storage in the backcountry.

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Joseph
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Joseph
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PostSun Apr 16, 2023 1:18 pm 
BigBrunyon wrote:
Im thinking it's probably because they know about a large number of grizz sightings that they are HIDING ffrom the public eye!! The government always hides the grizz sightings!!
Not sure if you're serious or not. But with social media, I'm sure "they" would be unable to hide grizz sightings from the public eye.

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grannyhiker
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PostSun Apr 16, 2023 2:17 pm 
As I suspected, they use the IGBC list: https://igbconline.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/221214_Certified_Products_List.pdf As previously noted, two models of Ursack are on the list. If you have really old models (like the one I bought in 2007), they may not have passed the grizz test. Also note that not all the containers that are allowed in the Sierra Nevada passed the grizz test. Back in 2010, I bought a Wild Ideas Bearikade before finding out that they didn't pass.

May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view.--E.Abbey
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Pyrites
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PostSun Apr 16, 2023 2:17 pm 
Does this change food I carry in my day pack, or overnight only. ____ black bear isn’t going to get my lunch or even push me out of the trail.

Keep Calm and Carry On? Heck No. Stay Excited and Get Outside!
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RumiDude
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PostSun Apr 16, 2023 3:54 pm 
IGBC Approved Containers So yea, Ursacks are approved. I have two old style and two of the new. I actually like the new style better. YMMV I also have three BearVaults and one Counter Assault Bear Keg. You could say I'm loaded for bear. haaaaahaha Rumi~the bearanoid~Dude

"This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all."
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Kim Brown
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Kim Brown
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PostSun Apr 16, 2023 8:53 pm 
Thanks for posting Exhibit B. As suspected, bear cannisters and Ursacks are not required. Hoping for lots of messaging and how -to's from orgs about how to hang food.

"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area." Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
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RumiDude
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PostSun Apr 16, 2023 10:06 pm 
Kim Brown wrote:
As suspected, bear cannisters and Ursacks are not required. Hoping for lots of messaging and how -to's from orgs about how to hang food.
After witnessing hundreds of supposed bear hangs, I can only remember a handful which actually fulfilled the required 10' clearance off the ground and 4' horizontal clearance from trees and branches. And in many places in Western Washington it is almost impossible to find a suitable tree near enough camp. And even in areas that do have suitable trees, few people have the skills. I have known many people that "claimed" they had the skill, but when I saw their hang it was evident they did not. And a bear canister or Ursack is just sooooo convenient and requires no skills other than tying/untying a knot or opening/closing a bear canister. So though not required, an Ursack or bear canister is highly recommended. Rumi

"This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all."

HikingBex
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Kim Brown
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Kim Brown
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PostMon Apr 17, 2023 8:22 am 
Oh yeah, I agree a canister or Ursack is best; but given the short notice and cost of this stuff, they need to offer a solution that anyone can do - even if they don't. They may eventually rent canisters as they do on the coast, but we're not there yet.

"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area." Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
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