Previous :: Next Topic |
Author |
Message |
wiki summary
|
Guidelines for posting in a dog thread
You shall make no more than 1 post in a dog thread unless you have posted or replied to a trip report (or photo) since your last visit. Thanking someone for their contribution goes a long way to building and fostering a sense of community!
Wiki summmary last edited by Tom on Sat Jan 19, 2019 3:01 pm (this post can be edited by any member)
Wiki summmary last edited by Tom on Sat Jan 19, 2019 3:01 pm (this post can be edited by any member)
|
Back to top |
|
|
cambajamba Member
Joined: 05 Nov 2011 Posts: 339 | TRs | Pics
|
It perpetuates the myth that native people have a primitive culture.
It reminds people of native descent that they are seen as inferior or primitive to the ruling class.
It perpetuates the stereotype that native people speak simply, or differently from american culture at large.
It recalls a legacy of borrowing tropes and symbols from native culture to advance the outdoor culture of "american" youth at summer camps during the formative decades of the 20th century, while at the same time teaching limited or outright incorrect information and history surrounding the wholesale genocide committed against native people BY OUR FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.
In so many ways I don't have time to educate on, it reminds me that what could have been my proud heritage is instead a source of constant misunderstanding and ridicule. In the way my Irish, Italian, or Dutch or Practically Anywhere Else peers celebrate their culture in parades, festivals, official holidays, etc - when indigenous people attempt the same thing it's somehow this divisive political thing instead of a celebration. What, like what the hell did we do to deserve this, STILL, after all these years? Didn't die out? Aren't being killed by racist bureaucracy and poverty fast enough?
Also how disgusting that some people think that Power with a capital P is the only thing that drives change. Know who else thought that?
"It is blood which moves the wheels of history."
- Benito Mussolini (not a good role model)
|
Back to top |
|
|
Chief Joseph Member
Joined: 10 Nov 2007 Posts: 7710 | TRs | Pics Location: Verlot-Priest Lake |
Many, many moons ago, mankind was not so easily offended, they had bigger issues to worry about...like where there next meal would come from.
Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof.
Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof.
|
Back to top |
|
|
fourteen410 Member
Joined: 23 May 2008 Posts: 2630 | TRs | Pics
|
cambajamba wrote: | It perpetuates the myth that native people have a primitive culture.
It reminds people of native descent that they are seen as inferior or primitive to the ruling class.
It perpetuates the stereotype that native people speak simply, or differently from american culture at large. |
But how? You haven't specified how the phrase "many moons" does any of the above. Humans have used the moon to measure time for tens of thousands of years, so I don't understand why this is offensive to Native Americans in particular. My mind is open, but you have to explain before you shame.
|
Back to top |
|
|
cambajamba Member
Joined: 05 Nov 2011 Posts: 339 | TRs | Pics
|
Seriously? By even existing as a common part of speech it reinforces these concepts in your mind. If you can't grasp such a simple concept I don't know how to help you, I'm not an educator, I'm just a person trying to live my life without being reminded constantly that I'm perceived as a second class citizen by a large portion of our population - even if they themselves don't realize they see it that way.
I'm tired and lost and have no hope for the future. I have been a part of this community for awhile and like a lot of communities that we built over the past decade(s) it's been tearing itself apart.
An author once remarked that it is a terrible thing to find something out about a friend. Things you are told are curated, easy. Things you find out can be shocking.
I found out over the past two years how a lot of my "peers" in the outdoor community think and feel about nature, each other, and who has a right to what kind of experience and I'm disgusted.
This forum tolerates hate speech and consists of loud voices that condone it explicitly.
I've spoken with other members who have left and I'm sorry to anyone who ever found value in my voice - but I'm done here.
I wish I'd done what you all wanted in the first place and kept my mouth shut.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Joseph Joseph
Joined: 13 Jun 2018 Posts: 265 | TRs | Pics Location: Seattle |
|
Joseph
Joseph
|
Wed Jan 23, 2019 2:00 pm
|
|
|
Fourteen410, you are not to question these things, don't you know? Just accept the words as revealed truth, without any real explanation. Anything short of that and you are a "hater". lol.
Quite ironic the earlier poster referenced Mussolini: the fascists manipulated language, and insisted on blind loyalty to them, a black and white mentality outside of which there is no compromise. i.e. fascism.
|
Back to top |
|
|
fourteen410 Member
Joined: 23 May 2008 Posts: 2630 | TRs | Pics
|
cambajamba wrote: | I'm tired and lost and have no hope for the future. |
Well, when you shame others for not understanding you but don't provide information to educate them, you have no one to blame but yourself. This could have been a learning moment for others, most of whom I imagine also don't know why the phrase "many moons" is offensive. But instead you shut that opportunity down by refusing to listen to the other side and bowing out when you couldn't find an explanation. Stop being a victim and start empowering yourself by educating others.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Kim Brown Member
Joined: 13 Jul 2009 Posts: 6900 | TRs | Pics
|
Hey how 'bout them Mariners! Edgar finally got his due, hey?
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
"..living on the east side of the Sierra world be ideal - except for harsher winters and the chance of apocalyptic fires burning the whole area."
Bosterson, NWHiker's marketing expert
|
Back to top |
|
|
joker seeker
Joined: 12 Aug 2006 Posts: 7953 | TRs | Pics Location: state of confusion |
|
joker
seeker
|
Wed Jan 23, 2019 5:02 pm
|
|
|
FWIW I've read the term "many moons" described on a list of terms created by native Americans who were describing terms they saw as pejorative. In this case they described it as implying a mix of laziness and use of "pidgin" English. Since I'd like to try to avoid offending people unnecessarily it's a term I'll therefore avoid using. I realize that this could be a slippery slope wherein we could grant everyone the ability to write up such lists and soon all phrases would be eliminated from use, but I don't see this as a case of falling down that slope. YMMV
|
Back to top |
|
|
fourteen410 Member
Joined: 23 May 2008 Posts: 2630 | TRs | Pics
|
joker wrote: | FWIW I've read the term "many moons" described on a list of terms created by native Americans who were describing terms they saw as pejorative. In this case they described it as implying a mix of laziness and use of "pidgin" English. Since I'd like to try to avoid offending people unnecessarily it's a term I'll therefore avoid using. I realize that this could be a slippery slope wherein we could grant everyone the ability to write up such lists and soon all phrases would be eliminated from use, but I don't see this as a case of falling down that slope. YMMV |
Thank you for sharing this info. This is all I was asking cambajamba to do.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Damian Member
Joined: 18 Dec 2001 Posts: 3260 | TRs | Pics
|
|
Damian
Member
|
Wed Jan 23, 2019 6:30 pm
|
|
|
cambajamba wrote: | This forum tolerates hate speech |
Well that's really not true. If a post is in question please notify a moderator.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Pyrites Member
Joined: 16 Sep 2014 Posts: 1885 | TRs | Pics Location: South Sound |
|
Pyrites
Member
|
Wed Jan 23, 2019 8:22 pm
|
|
|
Kim Brown wrote: | Hey how 'bout them Mariners! Edgar finally got his due, hey?
|
Good deal.
Hoping to see him on his roving coaching job this spring at Cheney.
Best.
Keep Calm and Carry On?
Heck No.
Stay Excited and Get Outside!
Keep Calm and Carry On?
Heck No.
Stay Excited and Get Outside!
|
Back to top |
|
|
Randito Snarky Member
Joined: 27 Jul 2008 Posts: 9514 | TRs | Pics Location: Bellevue at the moment. |
|
Randito
Snarky Member
|
Wed Jan 23, 2019 8:29 pm
|
|
|
FWIW: In both the Jewish and Islamic calendars months align perfectly with moon phases (i.e. each month starts with the new moon). The Jewish calendar is a Hybrid between lunar and solar and includes a "leap month" inserted periodically so that the Passover holiday always occurs during the spring. The Islamic calendar is fully lunar, which is challenging in higher latitudes when Ramadan falls near the summer solstice and the number of hours of daylight and thus fasting is very long.
The phrase "many moons ago" entered English usage after a pirate was stranded with the Kuna peoples in the 17th century for a time and was included in his journals when he returned to England.
I suppose first people's might consider usage by persons of European ancestry to be cultural appropriation.
|
Back to top |
|
|
joker seeker
Joined: 12 Aug 2006 Posts: 7953 | TRs | Pics Location: state of confusion |
|
joker
seeker
|
Wed Jan 23, 2019 9:07 pm
|
|
|
I suspect current usage (and reaction to it) has more to do with portrayal of native Americans/first peoples in various westerns (movie genre) over multiple decades than anything else, though the etymology is nonetheless interesting.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Chief Joseph Member
Joined: 10 Nov 2007 Posts: 7710 | TRs | Pics Location: Verlot-Priest Lake |
Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Ski ><((((°>
Joined: 28 May 2005 Posts: 12837 | TRs | Pics Location: tacoma |
|
Ski
><((((°>
|
Thu Jan 24, 2019 12:58 am
|
|
|
joker wrote: | I suspect current usage (and reaction to it) has more to do with portrayal of native Americans/first peoples in various westerns (movie genre) over multiple decades than anything else, though the etymology is nonetheless interesting. |
No doubt vocalized at some point in some cornball western television broadcast by Michael Ansara, a man of Lebanese descent, wearing heavy makeup.
Chief Joseph wrote: | Edgar deserved to be in the Hall on the basis of his numbers against Mariano Rivera, the best relief pitcher in the history of the game! |
Why did it take so long to get Mister Ice-Water-in-His-Veins Mariano Rivera inducted?
Respectfully, there's far too much butthurt here, especially in light of this argument about some moronic phrase perpetuated by clueless Hollywood screenwriters.
Maybe I should take great umbrage at the depictions of my Norwegian ancestors wearing horned helmets (an invention of the set and costume designers of Richard Wagner's operas) and spending their entire working careers raping, pillaging, and plundering?
Jesus Christ people... get over it already.
"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach.
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
"I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach.
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each."
|
Back to top |
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Disclosure: As an Amazon Associate NWHikers.net earns from qualifying purchases when you use our link(s).
|