[jenjen]

Alright, Sascha (our husky) went on a rampage yesterday and got 2 ducks and went after one of our goats. The ducks should live - wounded and still shocky but loudly complaining about the whole thing (good sign). The goat ducked under an old camper shell before the dog could get her. This can't happen again. For now, the dog is either in the run or on leash - no exceptions. A shock collar is the only thing I can think of to break the prey drive, short of beating the snot out of her everytime she looks cross-eyed at a critter. The other options, of course, are finding her another home and putting her down. My experience has been that if you're honest about the dog having a high prey drive, rescue societies and shelters won't take it or will take the dog and just put it down themselves. If she wanders off our property and bothers anybody else's animals, she will be shot (understandably). So..... Anybody used one of these? Are any brands better and more reliable than others? I know that the dog needs to associate the shock with the critter and not the collar or the transmitter - any other training tips? I plan to start her on a leash, then long line, before moving on to having her and a bird in a pen together (with me right there holding a shovel handle for backup). I'm mining several sources for info on this, and I know there are hunters and others with stock on this board - input is greatly appreciated! No flames, please. This is a bad situation all the way around. My pet is trying to prey on stock and has gotten the taste of blood - that will get her killed if I don't stop this in it's tracks. The other dogs are just fine with stock, I really don't need them picking up on Sascha's behavior.

[ActionBetty]

I had two lab mixes that liked to jump the fences and terrorize the neighbor hood. We tried the shock collars to keep them in an already fenced in yard...I dont think they were for the right sized dog. Those two found the source of the shock and chewed through the wires...had to get rid of one of dogs and the other one calmed down and stuck around. Since its just one dog.. this might be a solution for you. Just make sure it the right size or the dog will just jump the boundry and endure the little shock. I think it's great that you are taking precautions to make sure your animals are safe as well as neighbors that might be affected. Once dogs get that lust to "hunt"..it's something you arent likely to change. good luck.

[Criminal]

A less expensive option you might try is a pinch collar. Bring the dog near something he wants to eat on a short leash, if he pulls towards the thing, snatch him back sharply. This may teach him that you disapprove of that particular behavior.

[Dogpatch]

No suggestions here, just an expression of sympathy. Good luck with the retraining--I hope it goes well.

[jenjen]

Just to clarify, I'm not talking about the invisible fence type collars (tried those in town and wasn't happy with them). The collars I'm talking about have a handheld transmitter I would press to administer the shock at whatever level is necessary at a range of up to 500 ft. The dog needs to know that any critter, anywhere means a nasty and painful surprise - on my property, on my neighbor's property, in town, wherever. We have a fenced run the dogs stay in when we aren't here. The critters all have their own fenced areas. Birds aren't that smart, unfortunately, and can flap enough to occasionally make an escape. Sascha slipped into the pasture behind me to chase after the goat. Thanks, everybody!

[ActionBetty]

hey jen jen..check this lady out. You might want to scroll down and find that others have written in with the same problem and she might have some good advice.. http://www.dog-trainer.biz/dogtrainingq&A.htm

[Toonces]

Shock collars are only effective when worn by inexperienced dog owners. Learn to train your dog, not torture it.

[Lagerman]

They are effective. My friend married a gal with an idiot boxer. Shaped him right up

[salish]

JenJen, I've been using an electronic training collar for a few years now for my Llewellin setter. Bird dog types prefer to call these "training collars" since there is a whole lot more "training" performed with one as opposed to merely shocking. My setter was/is a hardheaded bird dog, meaning he was/is extremely bold and independent. Bold and independent is a fantastic trait in a bird dog, but it can also be very hard to control the dog. It's sort of good and bad at the same time. Anyway, my dog had a very bad habit of taking off for hours to hunt for himself, blowing off my voice and whistle commands in the process. There were times he would be gone for hours in the hills of central Washington, and I thought he was coyote bait. He also had a habit of taking off and chasing birds across busy highways, across rivers (he once swam one mile down the Snoqualmie and chased tweety birds around on the opposite bank, on some farmers property). After working with an obediance instructor - and a professional trainer for two years on getting a handle on this dog, we turned to the e-collar during training sessions and it solved all of my problems with his running off and blowing me off. He was so hardheaded that we had to dial up the intensity a few times during his training sessions, and he yelped a couple of times, but he quickly learned that if he did what he was commanded to do - and didn't do the things that got him in trouble, he'd be fine. For the past two years I've only had to correct him two or three times, and these were on the lowest setting. On the lowest setting I can hold the shocking device in my hand and apply it to myself and is does not hurt at all. I place the collar on him every time I take him afield. The way I see it, the collar has saved his life many times over, keeping him from running off into the country side, or running across a busy highway. I disagree strongly with Old Goat's use of the word "torture" in regard to these devices (respectfully, Old Goat). As for claims that these are inhumane to use on your pets, all I can tell you is that when my dog sees me grab the e-collar he gets all excited and starts jumping around and wagging his tail because he knows that he is going out to have fun. I participate in hunting tests and field trials for upland hunting dogs and that's the way they all behave when they see the collars come out. I am a very big proponent of using e-collars on hunting dogs, but by the same token when one is used incorrectly or inappropriately on a dog, it can have bad consequences for the dog, causing him to be a bootlicker (afraid to do anything wrong for fear of being shocked) and it's just plain disgusting to see a dog being shocked when it shouldn't be. It's a huge responsibility for a dog owner to learn to use one of these collars appropriately. The collar is to be used as an supplement to the training, which is the most important function - not the other way around. There is information available on-line and in print about how to use these collars safely and effectively, and the collar will also come with instructions on it's use. I'll never be without one. In fact, my wife and I are picking out a new English setter pup today, and I know I'll be using my e-collar a little bit later on with him. It might save his life. The model I use is the Tri Tronics Field 70, but I think they may call it the "Classic 70" now. http://tritronics.com/ These are good, standard e-collars with 5 levels of intensity. These are expensive - my model runs $299.00. There are cheaper models and some that cost more. There are lots of different brands and models available. A good place to look is at Lion Country Supply (don't have their URL handy). Please PM me if you need any more info. I also have a good friend who is a Pro dog trainer (of upland bird dogs) but he could probably help you with your dog, or offer some suggestions as to other avenues for you to pursue. Good luck! Cliff

[jenjen]

[Hiker Boy]

My suggestion....Take your dog to obedience training. If it is untrainable, it's either the dog or the other farmyard critters..your choice.

[jenjen]

Thanks for the links, Cliff and Actionbetty. I didn't know what to call the collars, I've never needed one before.

[Slugman]

I'm sorry to hear of your troubles. I would consider trying to get Sascha adopted before I would put her down, which seems like a last resort to me. I know from experience that it's hard to get a dog to stop doing something that it really, really wants to do. Some dogs are very focused and hard-headed and just can't be trusted without close supervision. I think the control collar might work, because you can show the dog how it works with you right there, then hide in the house and see if she still obeys, and shock her if she doesn't. Eventually she may figure out that she must obey even if you are not standing there. Good luck.

[Damian]

Our dog has a shock collar. Has for years and it has worked great. She learned very early where the boundry was. The box emits a warning beep before shocking her. The warning beep is all thats ever needed. Its a great invention. She will not leave the yard, even if another dog tempts her. They don't work with all dogs though. I know of others that are willing to risk the shock to escape. Talk to the manufacturer. They know how to train even the toughest dogs with these devices. You must follow a strict training procedure to make them effective. They also come in varying levels of voltage, depending on how stubborn the dog is. They cannot hurt the dog. Voltage is high, but current is very low and does not pass through any organs.

[jimmymac]

Jen, I'm so sorry to hear about Sasha getting so completely out of step with the program up there. Torturous as it is to deal with Friday's incident, at least you got tipped off to the problem without any more casualties. A soft failure, as they say in engineering circles. Your choices sound painfully limited. I'd go with something that has some certainty of outcome. If "plan A" fails two months from now, you could be right back to where you are today, but with much more far reaching consequences than Friday. I really feel bad for you guys.