[Malachai Constant]

The Ptarmigan Traverse is a well established alpine (climbing) route which requires commitment and preparation. Like other such routes such as the Isolation Traverse, Bailey Traverse and Picket Traverse there are no practical "escape routes" especially now that access roads have been closed due to washouts. Spire point is near the end of the traverse. They apparentlydid everything right but were caught by weather and circumstances.There is no reason to dis them because of where they live because you cannot get to Spire Point from Cascade Pass if you are incompetent

[joker]

[plain old dan]

Layback, not trying to be disagreable with you but to compare "several peaks in the ADK 46 that are off trail" to what's available in the NW is silly. Also, the few places like Huntington are all well and good but I think you would have to agree that NE lacks the sheer volume of routes available in the Northwest. I do agree with your basic premise - you can be a good competent climber based soley on experience in the NE. In fact that's where many a climber has gotten started but often times they move on ... perhaps like you and me Make no mistake, I'm not commenting one way or the other on this particular couple and their experience or lack thereoff (they could be seasoned Alaskan adventures for all I know) I was just pointing out to those that might think differently - terrain in NE is not as rugged or varied as the NW and attempts to compare the two is stretching it. Anyway, I love both areas Carry on.

[tenaya123]

And you all thought the local papers got it wrong! (At least this guy has an excuse -- he lives in flatland, on the other side of the continent. So I sent him a nice email explaining that despite was Matt's mom said, he wasn't on Rainier.) From the Greenfield, MA Recorder: Rescued from Mount Rainier By GEORGE W. CLAXTON Recorder Staff Published: Saturday, August 30, 2008 A Franklin County couple who were stranded at the 8,000-foot level on a mountainside in the North Cascades of Washington state since Wednesday began walking down the mountain Friday to a point where were picked up by helicopter. The climbers, Matthew Edwards, 32, and Robin Gibson, 27, live in Wendell and had traveled out to the Northwest to climb Mount Rainier, according to Frances Baker, Edwards' mother. 'This was Matt's third time climbing Mount Rainier. This was the first time for Robin,' Baker said. According to his mother, Edwards, a 1994 graduate of Turners Falls High School, played baseball while he was at school and later developed a love of mountain climbing. http://www.recorder.com/story.cfm?id_no=5279347

[Kat]

[touron]

Well as they say, Rainier creates its own weather. Maybe it has direct influence on internet reports too. I wonder where the 2000 foot level of Rainier is--maybe the Hilltop area in Tacoma?

[Toonces]

[pimaCanyon]

[DIYSteve]

Yes, an analysis is always warranted in these cases. But it appears to me that the analysis is this simple: 1. They enagaged in routefinding that was good enough to get them to and up the Dana Glacier, very near the completion of the PT. So far, so good. 2. Then they got off route when trying to get to and over Spire Col. Poor visibility likely contributed to their error. 3. Their routefinding error led them to a ledge, where they were, by their assessment, stimied. (That they were on a ledge is proof that they were off route. The route from the margin of the Dana to Spire Col is easy terrain, and the descent from Spire Col is moderately angled scree, followed by mellow terrain down to Itswoot Ridge camp). 4. They dropped one of their two backpacks 5. They live E of the Mississippi Am I missing something? This sort of sh** happens even to experienced PNW climbers. I would hope it would not happen to my party (we'd have oodles of GPS waypoints potted on more than one GPS unit and we've been there before, so I'm confident that we'd make it to and over Spire Col in a whiteout, or that we would have waited for the soup to clear).

[reststep]

Maybe they did come out here to climb Mt. Rainier. I don't think we know. Maybe they were going to do Rainier in addition to the Ptarmigan Traverse. Also I don't think we know what their experience level is. Just because they are from the east coast does not mean they don't have extensive hiking and climbing experience.

[puzzlr]

I'm catching up on this thread after being out camping for a few days. I sympathize with this couples difficulty in finding the correct route over the pass near Spire Point, and I'm glad they're out safe. In clear weather it's easy, but even then we had some trouble on the far side scrambling down the correct route, with some back and forth scouting for easy going. Here's a shot from the N showing that there a multiple low points on the ridge near Spire Point. In a white out it would be hard to identify the correct one -- that one on the far left would be a very poor choice.

Posted and annotated for inclusion in this nwhikers post about the hikers needing rescue in this area.

[the dude]

Thanks to all the posters who seem to have tacitly agreed to ignore Workman's reference to the Pamela Almli shooting, and keep this thread on topic. Clearly, those who live outside the borders of the great state of Washington are not prepared for the challenges of hiking our trails. As Workman points out, they go out in nominal weather (yes, the weather is in fact named weather - perhaps he meant marginal?), they travel without maps and compasses, and they are not mentally prepared. Allowing these ill-prepared out-of-staters on our trails leads to high costs for Washington taxpayers for SAR expenses. The obvious solution is to bill out-of-state hikers to use our trails. This should be enforced by requiring all hikers to register at trailheads and show identification identifying their state of residence. Out of state hiking fees should be levied in proportion to the amount of mountainous terrain in the hiker's state of residence - hikers from Idaho, Montana or California should pay $5 per day, while those from Kansas, Delaware and Florida would pay $20 per day to hike Washington trails. This will likely be implemented in other states as well. We Washingtonians are probably as unprepared for the conditions in Wyoming, Colorado and Alaska and those from the neighboring states of Massachusetts and Wisconsin are for our conditions. When travelling to out of state hiking destinations, we should be prepared to register our state-of-residence at the trailhead and to pay for the use of their trails. I'm sure Workman will agree, this modest proposal is the only sensible way to protect Washington taxpayers from the spiraling costs of rescuing ill-prepared out-of-state hikers. TAKE BACK OUR TRAILS!

[Dogpatch]

BRILLIANT!

[Dave Workman]

[Dave Workman]